Soul bits (Was: CHAPDISC: HBP 23, Horcruxes)

[Steve]

No: HPFGUIDX 160940

---  "justcarol67" <justcarol67 at ...> wrote:
> ...
> Jenni from Alabama responded:
> 
> > Actually, ... The memories that are placed in the 
> > pensieve that Harry witnesses are just that - memories
> > of the events, accounts of them - containing no soul 
> > at all. However the diary was a Horcrux. It contained
> > not only the memories/accounts of the events that 
> > Harry witnessed (the 'capture' of Hagrid) but the
> > essence of Riddle himself, a fraction of his soul.
> > ....
> 
> Carol responds:
> ... I'm arguing that the memory was placed there first
> as part of the plan to use the Basilisk to kill 
> Muggleborns, meaning that the diary was already a 
> powerful magical object before Tom added the soul bit 
> to make it a Horcrux. IOW, in my view the memory and 
> the soul bit are two different things.
> 
> The soul bit enabled the memory to possess the reader 
> of the diary (as with Ginny) rather than merely to 
> interact with the reader ...
> 
> Carol, whose entire argument can be read by going 
> upthread
>

bboyminn:

Once again Carol and I are on the same waverlength, though
I don't support her theory 100%, I do think she is on the
right track.

So, let me reach deeply into the subtext of the story and
tell you why I agree that the Soul and the Memory are
two separate items.

No one in the story seems at all surprised that Tom 
managed to encase his memories in an object, that he had
in a sense created a recorded duplicate of his 16 year old
self in that diary, or that the diary could be interacted
with. That seem to be take for granted. 

However, that fact the Tom was able to place a bit of his
soul in there too, does seem to be a very big deal. It
seems to be at the very center of the story, and is 
based on information that is not readily available to the
common wizard. 

Again, I admit I am reaching down below the surface of the
story into the subtext.

I suspect it may be possible for soul-bits to have a 
remote, sort of wireless network, connection to the main
core-soul and by extension be able to draw on that well 
of knowledge and information. Yet, being inanimate object,
that access to knowledge and information does them no 
good. It would have done the Diary no good, because the
diary already has a copy of Tom as he was at 16. Further
note that the core-soul is constantly updating its 
bank of knowledge and information, yet that one soul-bit
in the diary was not aware of Tom's history beyond age
16. That sort of shoots down the idea that the soul-bit
have some sort of network connection.

Finally, when Dumbledore is talking about this with Harry,
he warns Harry not to underestimate Voldemort. While losing
bits of his soul may have diminished Voldemorts sense of
humanity, Voldemort still retains all his cunning, intellect,
and personal and magical power, and by extension, all his 
memory.

I just don't see anyway to tie the soul-bit to Tom's 
memories. I realize this was just speculation about
possibilities, but I see nothing in the books or the
subtext of the books to imply that the Diary memories and
it bit of soul also contained therein are not separate
things.

For what it's worth.

Steve/bboyminn