[HPforGrownups] Re: JKR and the boys (and girls)

[Magpie]

No: HPFGUIDX 161619

Danielle:
As many people have pointed out, this is from Harry's point of view, he's 
not going to notice Ginny much. My older siblings friends never noticed me 
much either. Most don't unless the younger siblings are very outgoing and 
included in everything. Until OOPT Ginny was very shy around Harry.

Magpie:
And as it turns out her real personality isn't shy at all.  Go figure.

Harry does notice Ginny.  If he didn't notice her, she wouldn't be in the 
book at all.  She has a perfectly coherent personality in books 1-4 with 
plenty of opportunity for us to certainly know that Hermione is doing stuff 
with her. And another perfectly coherent personality in books 5-6 with a 
certain relationship with Hermione that we see.  JKR manages to put across 
that Dean and Seamus are friends that way, and that Neville doesn't have 
friends. Harry lives with Ginny most of each year. Seems kind of silly to 
say there's no way JKR could pass a Ginny/Hermione relationship in front of 
his face. It's as easy as throwaway lines about Hermione filling her 
non-Harry/Ron time with Ginny instead of knitting or being in the library or 
making SPEW stuff or writing to Viktor or studying or being with Hagrid--all 
of which we hear her doing (without giving away the secret H/G even, since 
imo the obvious reason Hermone is friends with Ginny is because Ron is 
Ginny's brother, and Hermione shares her room at Ron's house, at least from 
the beginning of GoF onward).

 Of course she doesn't do that because it interferes with what she needs. It 
gives Hermione a big relationship to juggle at Hogwarts when she usually 
needs her focused on Harry or Ron all the time. She also needs to get rid of 
Ginny when she's not needed. If she's too close to Hermione she would have 
to either be involved or kept out of the loop.

Deanielle:
Plus Harry didn't really rock the boat much, so he wouldn't have gone thru 
the trouble of making friends, because he would feel bad about being invited 
to his friends home and never being able to invite them to his because 
petunia would never allow it. And again, the story is told from the 
viewpoint of when he goes to hogwarts. So he could have had friends when he 
is at school, that he just doesn't socialize with outside of school or 
school activities.

Magpie:
Actually, I was re-reading PS recently and it's pretty economical the way 
JKR puts it across.  Harry's basically got to be Cinderfella and a regular 
kid.  That is, we're set up with this kid in a really bad home situation, 
but clearly it's not a story about a kid who's going to learn to deal with 
that situation because he's not looking to adapt at all.  He hates things at 
home, understandably, but also hates things at school--and that doesn't seem 
to just apply to any time Dudley and his gang are chasing him. He feels like 
a regular kid who just hates school. We've got the throaway excuse for 
friends with Dudley's gang, but of course that's all it is.  A fictional 
excuse that we're supposed to accept-Harry's a cool kid but has no friends 
because his cousin's a bully and scares people off.   In fact, even more 
ironic, the one person who is not mean to Harry is Mrs. Figg and he hates 
being with her too because she's boring. Harry's Muggle life doesn't just 
suck in the dark Dursley way--it's also boring with stuff like school and 
old ladies with cats.

Basically, Harry makes perfect sense as a protagonist of a book who's not 
staying in this world long.

Danielle:
 It's getting to the point where everyone is nitpicking every little detail, 
that you are getting away from the point that this is a piece of fiction. 
Authors may try to make things work in a real way, but it doens't always 
turn out that way. GET OVER IT!!!

Magpie:
This is a list about analyzing these books.  That means we look at what JKR 
does and what she doesn't do.  Pointing out that she's not doing a 
particular set up for her protagonist is not necessarily missing the point, 
it's noticing how the book works.  We analyze on the list. That, too, can be 
gotten over with effort.

Jeremiah:
I'm sorry to those of you who feel let down. I look at it as a system for 
getting us to the end. There are somethings that seem a bit contrived but 
the enormity of this story is such that there has to be a bit of streaching 
with the emotions.

Magpie:
I wouldn't say I have no expectations for the books because of course we all 
do--expectation is part of reading.But in describing the things that I 
thought were a letdown I thought I already said I knew this was true.  I 
feel like I get that JKR is concentrating on some things and not others, 
which is why it doesn't surprise me when, for instance, the moments I 
mentioned suddenly go away. I don't think it's always quite fair to claim 
this is an expectation in the sense of wanting the books to be written my 
way. Building expectations is part of writing, and setting up an emotional 
scene does raise the expectation it will be fully played out. JKR's always 
playing with expectations and probably intends to satisfy them.
But I still think it's interesting to talk about that, because sometimes the 
trade-off creates another element to the series as well. It's part of it 
too.

I mean, I agree that it's a system of getting us to the end, but that's 
exactly what we're saying, that it often reads like a system to get us to 
the end--or especially in HBP, to kill time until the real story can come to 
a head in June.

-m