Magic late in life

[justcarol67]

No: HPFGUIDX 161893

Carla wrote:
> >>Be very careful!! I brought up the very same thing about Vernon on
just a "wouldn't it be funny" basis and a member of the "Book Gestapo"
jumped all over me, quoting chapter after chapter and frightening
everyone away from even dicussing it. ;)
> >
> >
> > Lana writes:
> >   Yes, I did catch that Carla.  I have just been put in my place
very efficiently on a different topic.  With no canon to support the
other side I might add.  My opinion had canon to support it, but since
it is not a popular belief, it was shot down quite forcefully.
> 
> Magpie;
> Well, I wasn't going to say anything, but since it's now coming up,
I didn't think Carla was shot down by a book gestapo. I, too, assumed
that she was suggesting that Vernon really was magic, since generally
this list is about analyzing the books--I'm not sure what anyone is
supposed to reply to a "wouldn't it be funny if..." except "yes, that
would be funny," since it's not talking about the books. I thought
Carol (I think it was Carol) was simply replying to it as such with
canon reasons she didn't think it would happen and I don't really
think it's fair to suggest she was bullying or shutting down
discussion. Seemed to me she was entering into the discussion
seriously, along the lines she's used to talking on the list.

> Just to give the other perspective, I very much appreciate the focus
on canon on this list. "Wouldn't it be a gas" doesn't interest me as
much. If all opinions are equal because we're snowflakes and
anything's possible there's not much to discuss. I've definitely dug
my heels in on some issues if I think canon supports me and others
don't agree, and it's not because I don't respect other peoples'
opinions, it's because I'm here to talk about what I think is actually
in the books. I'd hate to think that when I'm presenting why I think
something doesn't work I'm thought of as being rude. If someone
disagrees with an idea without convincing canon, usually people just
keep presenting it.

Carol responds:
Thanks, Magpie. You're right. I didn't intend to shut down discussion
and was merely presenting canon to demonstrate the unlikelihood of
what I took to be a seriously presented speculation about Uncle
Vernon. (It's very hard to tell when someone is joking in writing,
BTW. If I'd known it was just intended as a humorous aside, I wouldn't
have bothered to present counterarguments. Usually poeple like having
responses to their posts, even if the responder disagrees. At least he
or she read it and took it seriously enough to use up one of his or
her five posts on it.) A canon-based counterargument is not bullying.
It's encouraging, not discouraging, discussion. At any rate, that was
my intention.

Magpie:
> Vernon could know something of magic from Petunia. I think the text
makes it clear that he is indeed ignoring magic things that are
happening in front of him--but also that Muggles do that in general. I
admit I think the Muggle vs. Wizard premise is one of the foundations
of the books that would be threatened if Vernon could just do magic.

Carol responds:
Good point. Also, if he could do accidental magic, which usually
occurs when someone is angry or frightened, he'd have done it by now.
He would never pick up a wand, nor does he know any spells, but even
if he did, JKR has made it clear in interviews that Muggles can't do
magic. They can't even make a potion using magical ingredients because
a potion requires a wand for stirring, and a wand is nothing more than
a stick of wood in their hands. I can cite the interview if necessary. 
> 
> Lana:
> >  I also think it would be a blast if it were Filtch..  That would
be a gas  considering he couldn't get the quick spell course to work
for him.. LOL
> 
> Magpie:
> My vote goes for Filch. He and Figg are the two Squibs, but Filch
wants it more. I'm hoping it's Filch, that is, but in general I assume
it would have to be a Squib.

Carol responds:
Filch is certainly a possibility since he had magical parents, knows
what a wand is for, and no doubt knows the incantation for a number of
spells. The same is true for Figgy. Since Filch tried and failed to
learn elementary magic from the QwikSpell course, I think Figgy is
slightly more likely to be able to perform it, and as member of the
Order, is more likely than Filch to have contact with Harry during
Book 7. I also prefer Figgy to Filch because she's such a feisty
character (as opposed to spiteful and envious, like Filch, who has
manacles in his office and would have loved to whip the Weasley
Twins). Not that I expect my personal preference to sway anybody who
prefers a different character. :-) Also, Filch and Figgy genuinely
qualify as being "late in life," whereas Petunia and Vernon are
middle-aged. I know that some people read "late in life" as "late in
developing magic," but the phrases really aren't equivalent. Just use
"late in life" in another context and most people will think you mean
at age sixty or later.
 
> Magpie:
> Not to get all book gestapo, but what about JKR's saying "she is a
Muggle" is unclear? She's said she doesn't lie in interviews, and
saying that Petunia is a Muggle when she's really a witch who hasn't
accepted her magic sounds like a lie to me.

Carol:
Not to mention that in every book, the Dursleys are referred to as
Muggles ("not a drop of magical blood in their veins," as the narrator
says somewhere--I think GoF but pleas correct me if I'm wrong.) Yes,
the narrator is sometimes unreliable, but in all six books? And, as
you say, JKR has confirmed the truth of this particular statement in
interviews.

When JKR says that "there's more to Petunia than meets the eye," I
think it has to do with her knowledge of the WW, in particular her
knowledge of the content of Dumbledore's letter(s). I'm betting that
Harry will find out information about his parents, particularly Lily,
or about Godric's Hollow, from her. I've had the feeling since chapter
one of SS/PS that she's keeping secrets from Vernon. IMO, her hatred
of the WW is at least as strong as his, but it's based on a more
detailed understanding than his simple fear of abnormality and what
the neighbors will think.

Carol, trying to further discussion on the topic, not suppress it
(counter-canon is welcome!)