FWIW: Potter's Cash (and vault size)

[Steve]

No: HPFGUIDX 161935

---  "Neri" <nkafkafi at ...> wrote:
>
> Steve wrote:
> <snip>
> > As a means of guessing Harry's wealth, we can take the 
> > scene in which Harry first enters his Vault and use that
> > as a model. ...
> >
> > Nine Cubic Feet of coins (3ft x 3ft x 1ft) is 
> > approximately 198,288 coins using 5/64 inch as the 
> > thickness and 1 inch as the diameter. <snip>
> 
> 
> Neri:
> The 9 cubic ft heap of gold coins is the part of your 
> calculation that clashes with my own private image. I
> somehow pictured the vaults considerably smaller, not
> an actual room but a kind of an elevated crypt in the
> wall, with a door that doesn't extend all the way down
> to ground level. Rather large for a safe, but not
> enough for several 9 cubic ft heaps. ...
> 

boyminn: 

Keep in mind that 9 Cu Ft doesn't have to be in a 3 ft by
3 ft x 1 ft configuration. It could be 2ft x 2ft x 2ft 
with a final one cubic foot stacked on top. That is 
certainly a smaller footprint. Even by my revised estimate,
a stack of gold of this size is still US$700,000. That's 
not small change and that would fit into a fair sized 
wall safe.

You do have a point though, what we assume the vault is
is more based on our mental image as we read the story.
Pesonally, I picture something similar to a walk-in
closet; maybe 5 or 6 feet by 5 or 6 feet. (5ft=1.52Meters,
6ft=1.83Meters)

Now certainly, and without a doubt, the Weasley Vault is 
a Wall Safe. I estimate between 1.5ft x 1.5ft and 2ft x
2ft. That may seem large but since she had to sweep her
hand through it to make sure she got all the money, it
would seem to have to be bigger than a cubic foot.
(1.5ft=0.46meter, 2ft=0.61meters)

Note when Hargid goes to the vault with the Stone in it -

--- Quote: Sorcerer's Stone---
"Stand back," said Griphook importantly. He stroked the 
door gently with one of his long fingers and it simply 
melted away.

"If anyone but a Gringotts goblin tried that, they'd be 
sucked through the door and trapped in there," said 
Griphook.

"How often do you check to see if anyone's inside?" Harry
asked.

"About once every ten years," said Griphook with a rather
nasty grin.

Something really extraordinary had to be inside this top
security vault, Harry was sure, and he leaned forward
eagerly, expecting to see fabulous jewels at the very 
least -- but at first he thought it was empty. Then he 
noticed a grubby little package wrapped up in brown paper
lying on the floor. Hagrid picked it up and tucked it 
deep inside his coat. Harry longed to know what it was, 
but knew better than to ask.
- - - end quote - - -

Note, Hagrid picked it up off the /floor/. Generally, one
would not refer to the bottom of a wall safe as 'the 
floor'. That makes me again think this is a walk-in
closet sized room. 

Also, keep in mind that it is unlikely that the Malfoy's
estimated fortune would fit in a wall safe.

> Neri continues:
> ...
> 
> Now, canon certainly isn't clear about the size issue.
> Harry's first visit reads:  
> 
> ***************************************************
> SS/PS, Ch. 5:
> 
the cart stopped at last beside a small door ...
> Griphook unlocked the door. ... Inside were mounds of
> gold coins. Columns of silver. Heaps of little bronze
> Knuts.
> ****************************************************
> 
> I can't conclude from here if it is an actual room or
> a hole in the wall, and what is the size of the "mounds
> of gold coins". 
> ...
> 
> **************************************************
> CoS, Ch. 4:
> ... Harry felt even worse when they reached his vault. 
> He tried to block the contents from view as he
> hastily shoved handfuls of coins into a leather bag.
> *******************************************************
> 
> Again, nothing clear, ... Harry trying to block the 
> view of his fortune make me think of a vaulted hole in
> the wall, with its floor about waist height, rather
> than an actual room.
> 

bboyminn:

Yes, I agree there is an element of implied inconsistency
here, but I don't think it is enough to sway me, or at 
least my mental image. Harry could be implying that he 
tried to block the view from the partly opened door as
he quickly step in and swept some coins into his bag.

I think JKR is the only one that can answer with 
certainty.

Note: as far as I recall, Harry has never had to go back
to his vault. Someone always gets his money for him,
not leaving us much information to go on.

> Neri continues:
:
> Another clue: in PoA, when Harry runs away from the 
> Dursleys and thinks he's an outcast, he seriously 
> considers emptying his vault and taking the content 
> with him:
> 
> ...
> 
> Now, the boy is obviously in stress and isn't thinking
> very clearly, but still, I doubt he'd consider even for
> one second "getting the rest of his money out of his 
> vault" if it were several cubic ft in gold, silver and
> copper filling a room-size space. 
> 
> 
> Neri
>

bboyminn:

Well, I admit I'm trying to force everything to fit my
particular model of Harry's wealth, but I have to say
that I think Harry in this moment is thinking in concept
rather than in practicalities. 

If he is going to be an outlaw, on the run from the law,
then he can't be strolling into Gringott's whenever the
mood strikes him. So, he has two choices abandon the 
money, and perhaps hope for a reprieve that would allow
him access at some later time, or to take all the money
at once and stash it somewhere where he would have access
to it.

In that sense, he is thinking practically, he knows he 
needs access to his money, and doesn't feel he will be
able to do that at Gringott's, so logically he has to
take it out, but I don't think he is thinking practically
in the sense of what is required to haul all that cash 
around and find an alternate SAFE place to put it. 

He is practical in conceiving his plan, but not practical
in the concept of mechanically executing it; he thinks 
about 'what' but hasn't gotten to the 'how' just yet.

Not a real important topic, but still interesting.

Steve/bboyminn