CHAP DISC: HBP 22, After the Burial

[horridporrid03]

No: HPFGUIDX 159383

> >> Allie:
> CHAPTER DISCUSSIONS: Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince,      
> Chapter 22, After the Burial
> <snip of summary, except for...>
> Harry accidentally brushes Ginny on the way out the portrait hole, 
> and she reprimands Dean, thinking he was trying to help her       
> through.
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
And if that isn't a sign that Ginny is just marking time waiting for 
Harry to notice her, I don't know what is.  Generally when girls get 
this bent out of shape over benign behavior they're looking for 
reasons to break up.

Either that or Ginny is just a colossal, erm, witch, who has no 
appreciation for gentlemanly behaviour.  (Never mind her, Dean, 
obviously your momma raised you right and you need to hold out for a 
girl who deserves you. <g>)

But that's just my opinion, on with the show...
 
> Discussion Questions: 
> 1.  Why does a girl deliver Harry's note from Hagrid, rather than 
> an owl?    

I recall taking that as a sign that owls have been compromised.  
Death Eaters are everywhere!  No owl is safe!

> Why isn't that girl named?

Harry doesn't know the name of any student who hasn't directly 
interacted with him.  Even if they're in his House.  (Or the dry 
answer, JKR couldn't be bothered coming up with a name. <g>)

> 2.  The Montgomery boy was attacked because his mother refused to 
> help the Death Eaters.  The books make it seem like the Death     
> Eaters are constantly threatening random and numerous wizards who 
> refuse to help them.  Are there enough Death Eaters for this to be 
> realistic? 

Based on the size of the WW, I think it's realistic enough.  
Especially when you consider that not every wizarding family sends 
their children to Hogwarts.  So we're already dealing with the elite 
in some ways.  Or at least those who see some future in WW 
institutions. (Ministry, Hogwarts, St Mungos)
 
> How many Death Eaters do we think there are?  What did they want 
> from the Montgomery witch?  Will we hear more about her?  

I doubt we'll hear more.  I think this information was thrown in for 
atmosphere more than anything. (Though I could of course, be wrong).

As to amount of Death Eaters...  The thing is, if something is done 
by a Death Eater minion (werewolf, giant) is it considered the work 
of Death Eaters?  I suspect that there are plenty of bad sorts more 
than thrilled with reeking a bit of violence here or there, and the 
Death Eaters (the genuine branded sort) are quick to use them.  And 
it all gets branded "Death Eater work".  Which it is.

> 3.  Harry was surprised to hear that werewolves sometimes kill    
> their victim.  Were you?

Um... NO!  Good Lord, Harry can be a bit of an idiot sometimes.  I 
think he's so intent on Lupin being pure as driven snow he's wearing 
fairly strong blinders. (With Snape-issues thrown in for good 
measure.)

> In PoA, didn't Snape seem to imply that Lupin could have killed   
> him during the Prank?  Why doesn't Harry remember that?

More than that, Harry obviously didn't pay attention to his DADA 
lesson on that subject.  And yes, I do think it all goes back to 
Snape.  When Snape speaks, Harry covers his ears.    

> 4.  Do you think there's any possibility that Harry took something 
> other than Felix Felicis?

I'm going to go with the easy and straightforward, no.  I'm betting 
there are theories though. <g>

> 5.  Harry didn't actually have 24 hours' worth of Felix Felicis,   
> he only had a 12-hour dose.  Is it possible that his "measured"   
> gulp didn't last as long as he thought it would?  Might he have    
> been on his own at the end of the conversation in Hagrid's hut?    
> Or was that just a flint?

I'm wishy-washy on this.  I recall suspecting Harry was on his own 
at the time, only it was never brought up.  Would JKR really hold a 
little lesson like that over to book 7?  Wouldn't it take a lot of 
effort to remind everyone and have Harry go through a Dumbo "I 
dropped my magic feather, I couldn't possibly fly!" kind of 
situation?

At this point, I think I'll go with Flint.  But that's subject to 
change. <g>

> 6.  How much of the effect of Felix Felicis do you think is       
> placebo?

My gut says all to most.  But there must be some magical influence, 
because I don't see any way for Harry to link Slughorn being in the 
garden to Hagrid's invitation all on his own.  Maybe it just 
intensifies your instinct?
 
> 7.  Do you think Harry acted recklessly under the influence of 
> Felix?  We know that when taken in excess, the potion can be 
> harmful.  Is there any possibility that something bad could have 
> happened to Harry even with this limited use? 

I don't think Harry was reckless.  But, his absolute confidence did 
hint, IMO, as to what dangers might arise.  I think especially as he 
was stranded out of bounds and had to work pretty hard to get back 
to Gryffindor.
  
> 8.  Harry thinks how upset Hermione would be by Slughorn making a 
> house-elf taste wine that could be poisoned.  Are we EVER going to 
> see something come of Hermione's obsession with house-elves?

Honestly, I doubt it.  I just don't see how it could be done.  
(Again, I'm prepared to be wrong.)

> 9.  What do you think would have happened if Harry had drank the 
> wine at Hagrid's?  Would it just have interfered with retrieving   
> the memory, or could there be some type of bad interaction between 
> the two drinks?  

I think he would have gotten a bit drunk himself.  I think that was 
all that was being warned against here.

> 10.  Slughorn acquires unicorn hair and Acromantula venom at 
> Hagrid's hut.  Are we going to see those items again, and how?

At this point, again, I doubt it.

> 11.  Felix tells Harry that Slughorn won't remember their 
> conversation in the morning.  Do you think that's true?  Even if   
> it is, a Legilimens like Voldemort could probably see the truth.  
> Is Slughorn in great danger now that he has given Harry the memory?

Slughorn could be.  And yes, I'm not sure it depends on Slughorn 
remembering the discussion or not.  Frankly I think the "he won't 
remember" was more for Harry feeling comfortable going all emotional 
on Slughorn.  It's not the sort of thing Harry is at all comfortable 
doing.  I think he needed to feel that nothing would be remembered.  

(In many ways this scene read as Harry seducing Slughorn, to me.  
I've always seen some dark connotations there.  From the moment 
Dumbledore left Harry alone with Slughorn to "persuade" Slughorn to 
return to Hogwarts.) 

> 12.  What was your reaction to the "remorseless" way Harry        
> described his parents' murder in this scene?  Do you think he only 
> did that because he had to, or is he less sensitive about the     
> subject now? Is this a different side to Harry than what we       
> usually see?  What does this tell us about Harry's growth since we 
> met him as an eleven-year-old?

Betsy Hp:
I don't think it's any easier for Harry (hence the "no one will 
remember this" bit) but I do think Harry sees the necessity to do 
just about anything to help defeat Voldemort.

Does it show growth?  I was about to say yes, but Harry was pretty 
determined to do just about anything to defeat Voldemort in PS/SS.  
He even envoked his parents' murder with Ron and Hermione, IIRC.  
But at the time he did it without thought or plan.  He was all 
emotion.

In this scene, Harry pretty much fakes emotion (or calls up an 
emotion, to be nicer) in a calculated move to get what he needs.  
Which is a more adult move.  And it was nice to see Harry do 
something calculated and not "seat of his pants".  So yeah, he did 
grow up a bit. (Too bad so much was drug induced.  I hope we see 
Harry doing something similar while *not* under the influence!)
 
> Many thanks to Ari Elf, aka Jen, for her help & suggestions!  

And thank you, Allie.  Good summary and questions.  I hope this 
discussion doesn't get lost in the deluge. <g>

Betsy Hp (happy to have the deluge, just to be clear <g>)