Re: CHAPDISC: HBP20, Lord Voldemort’s Request

[potioncat]

No: HPFGUIDX 158160

 AnitaKH wrote summary and questions:
snipping summary.

1) Later, we discover the "small girl" was Crabbe or Goyle, and he 
was serving
as lookout for Draco. Who suspected this was more than it seemed at 
the time? 
(I didn't at all suspect polyjuice, but I did think this wasn't just 
a throwaway
scene.)

Potioncat:
It never crossed my mind. It did let us know that you could use 
polyjuice to turn into anyone. That may be important in book 7.


4) What does the scene with Trelawney do at this point? It keeps her 
on the
reader's radar, but is there a larger purpose for seeing her at this 
point? Do
we need reinforcement that she is antagonistic to Firenze? Is its 
purpose to
remind us that she is in danger from the prophecy, of which she is 
oblivious?

Potioncat:
It shows the extent DD will go to protect someone--she doesn't know 
she needs protection, doesn't realize what he's doing for her. He now 
has two teachers for a subject he would have preferred to remove from 
the curriculum.  This sets the stage for Harry's later meeting with 
her, when he learns who the eavesdropper was.  If I'm right, she's 
unhappy about something every time he meets her. 

One of my favorite lines is in this section. DD says, "Divination is 
turning out to be much more trouble than I could have foreseen, never 
having studied the subject myself." It reminds me of Percy's 
statement, which was something like, "It's never too soon to start 
thinking about your future. You should take Divination."


5) In this scene, we see one of the few times that Dumbledore really 
calls
Harry to task for his failings. Does this scene fit the Dumbledore of 
Book 6? 
Does it fit the Dumbledore of Books 1 – 5? How did you feel about DD 
in this
scene?

Potioncat: 
It shows how important this is to DD. He's certainly let Harry get 
away with things before.  In some ways, he's encouraged a lack of 
responsibility.  It does fit DD, though., if you look at the overall 
DD and not just DD with Harry. Although he does seem to be more on 
edge overall in this book.

6) Do you find Dumbledore being manipulative here, playing on Harry's 
healthy
sense of guilt? Or is he genuinely seeking Harry's opinion for some 
reason?

Potioncat:
Perhaps there is a bit of building up after the dressing down. The 
wording would make Harry pay closer attention and think about what he 
was seeing.

7) Dumbledore talks about how disappointed certain staff members are 
that Tom
went to work at Borgin and Burkes. Is it because they see him as 
a "cashier,"
rather than an influential rising star, or is it because he's working 
for Borgin
and Burkes, purveyors of Dark Arts paraphernalia?

Potioncat:
We learn that Tom Riddle was well liked by the staff. He's already 
murdered, he's set loose the Basilisk but he's covered up that side 
of his personality and made himself appear to be a model student.  Of 
course, Slughorn, the one who suggests the MoM for Tom, already knows 
that Tom has an interest in the worst sort of Dark Arts. What does 
that tell us about Slughorn? I wonder which other of the faculty 
offered letters and whether they knew of Tom's interest in Dark Arts? 
So I'm not sure if it was the unsavory nature of Borgin and Burkes or 
if it was the lowly status of a store clerk that surprised the staff.

8) Idle speculation: if Dippet had still been Headmaster, would he 
have given
LV the DADA job when he returned to interview for it?

Potioncat: 
I find it intriguing that we know so little about him. We see other 
Portraits of Headmasters interacting with DD far more than Dippet 
does. Is this the nature of the help DD needs at the time, or does it 
tell us something about Dippet? Back in Tom's days as a student, 
Slughorn says DD doesn't allow the study of Horcruxes, not Dippet 
doesn't allow it. So either Dippet was weak, or naïve or was leaning 
toward the Dark Arts himself. 

My guess would be that, unless Dippet knew about Tom's real research 
into Dark Magic, he would have hired him.


11) This is the infamous "ten years later" scene that has caused much 
gnashing
of teeth. Is there any way to reconcile this timeline with earlier 
reports, or
do we just have to chalk this one up to Rowling's notorious maths? Is 
the
Fawkes's presence at the interview with Riddle important? Does it 
merely set
the scene, or should we look for deeper meaning?

Potioncat:
Lupin seems so clear that DD was hired after he was bitten. Yet, it's 
very clear in this chapter that DD has just become Headmaster, and we 
know McGongall becomes a teacher in 55/56. Yet I don't think it's a 
mistake. The best guess I can come up with is the use of a TT.  I 
don't know when it might have been used, or how
but that's the best I 
can do. 

It does seem that someone has proposed a date into the 60's for this 
interview rather than 55/56. I think based on Tom having been at B&B 
long enough to have a relationship with Mrs. Smith and to have the 
position he does with the shop. That would possibly reconcile the 
apparent difference.

I never gave Fawkes a second thought. Interesting that it was his 
tail feather in Tom's wand.

12) This scene encapsulated for me the whole dynamic of Voldemort's 
behavior
in the past that led to his downfall during his first reign. Are we 
to presume
these are the seeds of his destruction? How do you think Ollivander's 
use of
the word `great' to describe Voldemort in PS fits in with this 
exchange between
DD & Voldemort on the issue of `greatness'?"

Potioncat:
Ollivander's use of "great" makes us question his loyalties and 
ethics, doesn't it? It reminds me of those who would agree Hitler was 
horrible, then point out the good things he accomplished. (not my 
words, you understand) Or when generals from times long ago are now 
recalled for their greatness even though they were ruthless in war 
and invasion.

We haven't been told of anything he's done that would be "great." 
He's killed. He's experimented in immortality. But what has he done? 
I wonder what Ollivander means?


13) Are we to presume that the twitch Harry saw in the Pensieve 
memory is
Voldemort casting the DADA teacher curse? What else might he have 
been doing?

Potioncat:
We should think that if Harry saw it, so did DD. At least DD would 
have seen it in the Pensieve if he didn't at the actual interview. It 
could be a way to show us what was going on, but I have to admit, it 
could be intended to make us think that was all there was to it.


Great job at the summary and questions. And I really like having the 
paragraphs numbered to match the questions.