Time-turning (Was: World Building And The Potterverse)

[Ken Hutchinson]

No: HPFGUIDX 167420

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Jordan Abel" <random832 at ...> wrote:


> > Ken:
> > But then I discovered that this other book about how the South won the
> > Civil War involved no time travel, only three cigars and a piece of
> > paper. I've been reading Harry Turtledove's alternate historys ever
> > since, but only the ones that deal with plausible departures from
> > reality.
> 

> Jordon:
> What about the series (i forget the title) by him that deals with these
> but use some ridiculous interdimensional travel as a framing device?
> What do you think of those?
> 

Ken:

No, I only read his "reality based" stuff: the "How Few Remain/Great
War/American Empire/Return Engagement" series, "Ruled Brittania",
"Days of Infamy/End of the Beginning", and "In the Presence of Mine
Enemies". All are based on things that just as well could have
happened (arguably at least) but didn't. No time travel, no aliens,
nothing remotely resembling magic or science fiction. Turtledove is
sometimes brilliant, often banal and repetitive, but I enjoy him
anyway because I guess that most of the time he is good enough. 

Turtledove puts more care into getting the "maths" details correct,
Rowling puts more care into other elements of the story. Balance
people, balance.

> > Ken:
> > The Harry who we are to believe is his own salvation could throw the
> > Potterverse into a meltdown by simply refusing to go back, or to cast
> > a Patronus. That's a very odd way to run a Potterverse, in my opinion.
> 
> Random832:
> Except he doesn't know any of this. And that is the key here - if he
> did, there would be a risk of that - if nothing else he might _fail_ to
> cast Patronus due to overconfidence or whatever.
> 

Ken:

He doesn't know when he gets sucked into it but by the time he has to
cast the Patronus he knows full well. Harry, being Harry, would not
consider anything else. In the same situation Ken Hutchinson, or
Hermione for that matter, would hesitate too long while considering
the ramifications of the situation, the kiss would be given, and then
what??

Lets say for argument's sake that Harry and Hermione were their own
parents, as is allowed by this time travel theory. Where does the DNA
come from? The equivalent of billions of bits of digital information
is created out of nothing. Why are they human and not Kzinti or Orcs
or Centaurs? This type of universe just has to be unimaginably odd,
nothing like our universe or the Potterverse.

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "matt_le_wilson2002"
<matthew at ...> wrote:
>
> --- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Ken Hutchinson" <klhutch@>
> wrote:
> 
> > POA would work just as well without time travel.
> 
> Quite. Should we therefore conclude that the appearance of time travel
> in PoA is actually just to make us aware that it exists within the
> Potterverse?
> 
> My current theory is that time travel will be a key part of DH, either
> in back story or the main plot. (For example, in a universe with time
> travel, where a great enemy suddenly vanished after a confrontation
> with a young family, is it even conceivable that nobody travelled back
> in time to see what really happened? I don't think that it is.)
> 

Ken:

Later last night I reached the same conclusion. To paraphrase the cat
in "Babe", what if the things that seem to have no purpose really do
have a purpose? I don't want to see any more time travel in DH but
this argument carries weight. There's only two possibilities here:
either JKR was saying to us "Look at what I can do! Time travel too!!"
in POA or she intends to use it later.


--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "dungrollin"
<spotthedungbeetle at ...> wrote:
>
> > Ken:
> > I understand perfectly well the time travel theory used in HP and 
> I understand perfectly well that it seems more serious to many of 
> you. It is still an ugly wart to me. 
> <snip>
> In Harry Potter it seems jarring and unneccesssary. Rowling decided 
> she wanted to write a time travel story so it got tacked on. 
> <snip>
> POA would work just as well without time travel.
> 
> Dungrollin:
> 
> Would you feel better about it if it turned out to be vitally 
> important for book 7? Not in that they use time travel again, but 
> the effects of the events in PoA. 'Cause I was just doing some 
> elementary maths...
> 
> Harry jumped back and lived three hours over again, but he never 
> jumped forwards, so he is now three hours older than he should be. 
> Does this mean that the blood protection will expire three hours 
> earlier than Harry thinks, and did Pettigrew hang around long enough 
> in rat form to see Timetravelling Harry and Hermione, deduce what 
> they had done, and tell Voldemort? 
> 

Ken:

Would I feel better about time travel having been used at all? No.

Do I think you have hit upon another plausible idea for why Rowling
introduced it? Yes.

Ken