Part 4 - A Tale of Two Pretties

[julie]

No: HPFGUIDX 167833

Goodlefrood wrote:
> 
> The final instalment now, having delivered my favoured views of a
> possible good Snape and a possible not so good Snape. Here mostly
> for your entertainment is the downright ridiculous Snape.
> 
> Simply Snape's patronus is Nagini. 
> 
> Odd? No more so than his being Fawkes the Phoenix, IMO ;).
> 
> There is little support for this and from the matters in GoF, 
> particularly relative to the Foe Glass it is almost certainly
> incorrect. I give you the tale of two pretties :). It would, 
> having said that be an alternative for the two snakes seen when
> DD checked his instruments in OotP.

Julie:
The problem with figuring out Snape's Patronus is that he has
used it to communicate with the Order. What would Order members
(or Dumbledore) think if Snape's Patronus was Nagini? Isn't
that rather a dead giveaway that his loyalties lie elsewhere?
Equally, if his Patronus is something tied directly to DD or
the Order, such as a phoenix, then wouldn't the Order members
have commented on it ("But Snape's Patronus is a phoenix, and
how could he lie about what's in his heart!")?

I don't know if we have any canon for whether the Wizard has
any control over the shape of his Patronus, but I've assumed
a Patronus comes from the subconscious, reflecting the true
heart/feelings of the Wizard. Thus Harry's Patronus manifests
itself as a stag, representing his father as his protector.
And Tonks's changes from whatever it originally was to a
wolf in HBP to represent her newfound love for Lupin.

Again, that leaves us in a bit of a quandry trying to figure
out Snape's Patronus. If it clearly indicated his loyalty
to Voldemort or Dumbledore, this surely would have come up
in conversation in the books. If it indicates some past
love, like Lily, that too would likely have been mentioned
by Remus or Sirius (if only to harass Snape).

So either Snape's Patronus is something apparently innocuous
that may turn out to have a hidden meaning (say, his mother,
if she were to turn out to be Irma Pince, who's also been
spying in some way for Dumbledore all along)...or Snape's
Patronus is something actually innocuous (say, his mother
again, if she turns out to be dead or have little role) and
it will *change* in DH to reflect a new protector/guardian
(a bee or phoenix for Dumbledore, or this would be the time
for Nagini, if Snape is ESE and loyal to Voldemort). 

Goodlefrood:
> 
> On Snape's boggart I suggest that that may take the form of 
> seeing the Potters killed again, not that he saw that the first 
> time, but he has their deaths as his one true moment of regret, 
> IMO.
> 
> Both the suggested patronus form and the suggested boggart form 
> are presented to you due to JKR not being able to tell us what 
> they are, as in her words: "that would give too much away."

Julie:
I can buy this boggart, since no one else but Snape has to 
have ever seen it. Of course such a boggart rather suggests
a DDM!Snape, if he's so deeply regretful about the Potters'
deaths (as Dumbledore also stated). I have to wonder though
if we will ever see or know Snape's boggart. Given all he's
facing in DH, I'm not sure that a boggart would even faze 
him!

Goodlefrood:
> Just to wrap up the series of originating posts now I'll offer 
> a few possible ways in which Severus's story ark may play out in 
> DH.
> 
> The one that is not hard to fathom is that when we first meet him 
> in DH, if we actually do get some of Harry's radar chapters, he
> will be with Draco and making plans as to how they can hide from
> detection, being as Snape is now the second most wanted wizard in
> the ww.
> 
> As I have said in other posts on this thread I do believe Severus
> will be a help to Harry in his Horcrux quest rather than a 
> hindrance. If that is not the case then Harry will have problems 
> due to my other opinion of Severus, which is that he is in the 
> top three most powerful wizards we have met in the books to date.
> 
> Can anyone honestly envisage a scenario where Harry and Snape 
> team up early in the book and Harry accepts help from he whom he 
> currently considers to be the worst and most repulsive murderer 
> in history bar none? I have to say, I really don't think so, but 
> then I've been wrong before.

Julie:
I can't envision Harry and Snape teaming up early in the
book either, though I hope they do so in the final push to
defeat Voldemort. Of course, that can't happen until Harry
finds out more about the Tower and Snape's motives, thus
deducing that Snape, no matter how vile his personality,
is DDM. 

Goodlefrood:
> I hope that Snape will turn out to be assisting the "good" 
> because he has had a rough life from what we have been shown. 
> I hope that Snape will turn out to be "good" as Harry will have 
> severe problems if he is truly with LV. Perhaps Aberforth will 
> transpire to be an extraordinarily powerful ally for Harry, but 
> even then Snape and LV on the same side would be a formidable 
> opposition, not to mention Bellatrix and the often underestimated 
> Peter.

Julie:
Aren't you then hoping that Snape will be DDM? I do expect
Aberforth to be an ally for Harry, possibly a very powerful
one, no matter how Snape's character plays out. Though I
remain convinced Snape, Harry, and Aberforth are all on
the same side anyway ;-)

Goodlefrood:
> The only other small points that I want to say to wrap this up, 
> barring responses ;) are:
> 
> (i)When Hagrid says "No one ever lived after Lord Voldemort
> decided to kill them", it is my prediction that Snape will be 
> one possible exception to this.

Julie:
I hope Snape is the exception, as well as Draco (if the latter
actually took the Dark Mark).

Goodlefrood:
> (ii) The smoky white matter that took the shape of a phoenix at
> Dumbledore's funeral I predict will be DD's last message to Snape,
> whom DD did trust, whether misguidedly or otherwise :)

Julie:
I haven't heard that theory before, but it is an interesting
one. I wonder what message would Dumbledore have sent? 

Julie