good and bad Slytherins/Disappointment and Responsibility

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 175315

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Judy" <judy at ...> wrote:
<SNIP>
>> I don't actually think many Snape fans believe that Snape is 
> the "Good Guy in almost every situation involving him." (I don't 
> think I've seen a single person say that Snape was justified in 
> calling Lily a "Mudblood," for example.) Instead, they believe 
that 
> he was victimized by James and Sirius. That's a big difference.
<SNIP> 

Alla:

I did. He was you know, just being embarassed by being saved by a 
girl and who would not call a girl who tried to save you a Mudblood. 
Of course I am being sarcastic towards the argument and I am 
paraphrasing not my argument.

 
Judy:
<SNIP>
> As for Sirius, I don't currently see him coming in for the sort of 
> attacks that Snape is currently getting. (He did get attacked a 
lot 
> before Book 5, and he did get some vehement defenders then, just 
as 
> Snape is getting now.) Some people are currently saying that they 
> don't like Sirius and that they feel he was very unfair to Snape, 
but 
> I don't anyone denying that he had his good points -- he cared 
about 
> Harry, for example. But people *are* saying that Snape had no real 
> good points -- he was "creepily obsessed" with Lily instead of 
loving 
> her, he was abusive to children, etc. I even saw one person (Alla, 
I 
> think) saying how comforted she is to think of Snape being 
tormented 
> forever in the afterlife by seeing Lily in James' arms. Of course, 
> this is fiction and readers can intrepret things as they wish, but 
> it's no surprise that Snape's fans are going to respond by 
defending 
> him.  

Alla:

 I guess I need to clarify this point on list too.
Close but not quite. I said that I was imagining that as carmic 
justice for Snape for what he did to Harry. And yes, totally him 
tearing apart that much mentioned letter, and the photograph does 
give me that creepily obsessed vibe.

Nevertheless, upon reread I agree that Snape loved Lily as well, not 
just being obsessed over her, but the obsessive part for me is 
absolutely there.

And he did heroic deeds, sure, that is in the book.

What I am trying to say? I am not sure, frankly.

I had fun arguing over the years with **plenty** of 
Snape's fans who happily acknowledged his multiple bad points  and 
vigorously defended his good ones, but I also argued with Snape's 
fans who would not acknowledge **one** single  bad thing that Snape 
did. While dismissing  for example Sirius' love for Harry, yes, 
which IMO just 
stares at us in canon, just as Snape's bravery now stares in mine.

And it is their right obviously, but since I always acknowledged 
Sirius' faults, I sorta like to see that too. 

That is why I sooo dislike generalising Snape's fans or being 
generalised myself as Harry fan or Sirius' fan and saying that group 
thinks about the character. Different people think different things, 
even if they consider themselves to be Snape fans or HArry fans or 
Sirius fans in general.

And heheh, before HBP I also thought that Snape was loyal to 
Dumbledore, I always hated him as teacher, but I think I 
acknowledged **some** of his good points before he killed 
Dumbledore. Not after that though, no. But it is not like I **saw** 
those points after he murdered DD and just argued for the sake of 
arguing that they do not exist, you know?


JudySerenity: 
> If you would rather talk about something other than Snape and 
don't 
> want to see fans defending him, the solution is simple: Don't 
attack 
> him.
> 
> -- JudySerenity, not at all swayed from her love for Snape
>


Alla:
 I totally like Snape's fans defending him, just sometimes want to 
see that Snape may have done something indefensible as well. And I 
did have it often enough :)

And, far be it from me to try to sway anybody from their love for 
the character, LOL.

I loved talking about Snape and saying how bad he is too  A LOT ;)


--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "prep0strus" <prep0strus at ...> 
wrote:
<SNIP>
>> So, while I'm certainly willing to discuss characters and how they
> affect the story arc, I think it's equally as interesting and fun 
to
> discuss these characters as if they were people – at which point, I
> might add, no character is superior by simple measure of lines
> granted.  They are all equal, and can be discussed based on 
whatever
> canon is available. <BIG SNIP< HUGE>

Alla:

Me too, me too.