How do the books affect children? (was: Why down on all the characters?)

[a_svirn]

No: HPFGUIDX 179627


> a_svirn:
> I think you sort of confuse being unpopular with being notorious.
>
> Steph:
> I make a distinction between people like Fred and George, who are the
> really cool, popular kids, with Harry, who, while being important and
> appreciated at times for his Quidditch skills and ability to fight off
> Voldemort, doesn't have people knocking down his door to be friends
> with him, at least not until HBP.

a_svirn:
To use a famous quote "I see no difference". Harry's best friend
knocks at his door in PS because he wants to be close with someone
"cool". Harry's popularity in Gryffindor is comparable with that of
the twins. Fred and George also have only one really close friend –
Lee Jordan. (One less that Harry, actually.)
>
>
> a_svirn:
> In OotP for all his alleged unpopularity a few dozens of people turn
> up in a seedy pub to listen what he has to say. And they recognize him
> a leader from the get-go. Just imagine how many people would turn up
> if Hermione invited them to listen to *her* rather than to Harry. This
> is not what being unpopular means.
>
> Steph:
> This is not popularity. This is a group of smart kids who know that
> there's a huge threat out there and that Harry is the guy who's got
> the experience to get rid of that threat. <snip>

a_svirn:
That's not "unpopularity" either. An unpopular kid could not expect
such turn-out if he wanted to impart some important information.


> a_svirn:
> (Though unlike Ron she did not set out to befriend the famous Harry
> Potter.) - snip, snip, snip - If I want to rub shoulders with famous
> and celebrated it has nothing whatsoever with my desire to get
> important connections? Really? Why would I want to do so, then?
>
> Steph:
> Wow, you really dislike Ron, don't you?

a_svirn:
I don't, actually. I can acknowledge a person's weakness and still like
them, unless it is a particularly unsavoury weakness. Ron is drawn to
the "cool" and famous, there is nothing inherently wrong with that. He
has lots of likable qualities to make up for it.

> Steph:
<snip>You
> are taking a chance meeting on the Hogwarts Express platform as a
> deliberate move on Ron's part to "rub shoulders with the famous and
> celebrated." I've just pulled out my SS. The twins were the first
> ones to realize who Harry was, not Ron,

a_svirn:
Exactly. They helped his with his trunk, told their family that they
had just met *the* Harry Potter, and proceeded to seek Lee Jordan and
his tarantula. *They* did not try to befriend Harry Potter.

> Steph:
who actually didn't know until
> the twins pointed it out to him AFTER Ron was already sitting in the
> carriage with Harry.

a_svirn:
Not at all. they helped Harry to the carriage, then told their family
(Ron included), and then Ron hasted to claim a seat into the same
carriage with Harry under the pretext that everywhere else is full:

The door of the compartment slid open and the youngest redheaded boy
came in.
"Anyone sitting there?" he asked, pointing at the seat opposite
Harry. "Everywhere else is full." And then proceeded to ask questions
"Are you really?" etc.

> a_svirn:
> Didn't matter? When he was obviously consumed with jealousy all the
> time? To the point of succumbing to the Horcrux's influence?
>
> Steph:
> Ron's jealousy toward Harry was specifically about Hermione - look at
> his reactions regarding Krum.

a_svirn:
Not at all. His jealousy was on account of Harry's fame. That's what
Hermione says in GoF:

"Oh Harry, isn't it obvious?" Hermione said despairingly. "He's jealous!"
"Jealous?" Harry said incredulously. "Jealous of what? He wants to
make a prat of himself in front of the whole school, does he?"
"Look," said Hermione patiently, "it's always you who gets all the
attention, you know it is. I know it's not your fault," she added
quickly, seeing Harry open his mouth furiously. "I know you don't ask
for it.. . but - well - you know, Ron's got all those brothers to
compete against at home, and you're his best friend, and you're really
famous - he's always shunted to one side whenever people see you, and
he puts up with it, and he never mentions it, but I suppose this is
just one time too many. . .