Was Harry cheating at Potions (was:Re: Bathroom Scene - A Different Perspective.

[sistermagpie]

No: HPFGUIDX 165255

 
> --Betsy HP Wrote--
> <SNIP>
> >>>Yes, but Harry was hopeless. He didn't even know how to start. 
> Everyone struggled, but they were *doing* something. The Prince 
> didn't cover that particular area because he had nothing to add, 
so 
> Harry didn't study it. That's the crutch problem. He's relying on 
> the Prince to do *all* of his thinking. Does he get something good 
> out of it? Sure! But he's also got a bit too dependent.
> <<<
>  
>  
> --Ronin's Comments--
> Nobody knew how to start, other than Hermione. She and Slughorn 
were the
> only two in the class who understood Golpalott's Third Law. The 
Prince
> himself was annoyed by it's complication and just noted, "Just 
shove a
> bezoar down their throats".  (Harry Potter and the Half Blood 
Prince - 1st
> American Hardcover Edition, Pg. 377)
> Also, on the page before it says specifically that none of the 
students even
> realized Slughorn had finished talking until Hermione was half way 
through
> gathering her potions ingredients from the cabinets. Then everyone 
starts
> haphazardly attempts at making their antidotes. 
> It's not always a good idea to DO SOMETHING, when you have no idea 
what you
> are doing. This can get you killed. Like, cleaning a loaded gun, 
you don't
> just jump in and start "doing something" for the sake of doing 
something!
> He may have been dependent upon the notes, but no more than the 
others were
> dependent upon Golpalott's Third Law. He just had better luck. And 
he
> learned a much better and quicker solution to MOST poisons.

Magpie:
Actually, he'd already learned that. Or should have. Probably most 
of the kids in the class knew about bezoars. Hermione was quicker 
than they were on the uptake of GL, but in the end everybody's 
busily working at understanding the actual law--nobody finishes 
their Potion. Ron gives up. We don't know about the other students, 
but it's certainly possible than although they didn't immediately 
start doing stuff they were figuring out something because they were 
trying to understand the principles of the law. Harry learns about 
bezoars, but I don't think that can really be a triumph at this 
level. It seems like he's basically giving a first-year answer as 
cheek, which Slughorn finds cute (but might not have depending on 
the person who did it), but he's not learning anything at NEWT 
level, which was the point. The other kids may or may not, but it's 
possible they wound up having a far more productive class Potions-
wise than Harry did.
> --Ronin's Comments--
> I don't think this is cheating at all. Cheating is when you use 
somebody
> else's answers without doing anything. Cheating is when Hermione 
confounded
> McLaggen to help Ron get on the Quiditch team. What Harry did was 
use the
> textbook and the note to achieve a much more efficient method. The 
notes did
> not create the potion themselves. Harry had to crush the 
ingredients and
> stir them, just as everyone had to do following instructions that 
were
> written for them by someone else. And he didn't know if it would 
even work.
> He took a chance with the notes and it payed off. It could've been 
a total
> disaster. So, he had no idea it would help him win the Felix 
Filicus. 

Magpie:
Yes, it's not so much that Harry is cheating, since he is following 
instructions same as everyone else, but that the contest is fixed. 
There's no way anyone can beat him because their recipes are 
inferior. 

Ronin:
Harry used someone's notes in a school provided textbook and learned 
a
> few spells and antidotes. He never erased anyone's memory or gave 
credit
> (Probably because in part, he didn't know who the Prince was) and 
he
> certainly never gained fame or wealth for it. 

Magpie:
But he did do that. He gained a repuation with Slughorn as a Potions 
genius, which I assume is what was being referred to. He benefits 
from that false reputation with Slughorn. That's where Harry knows 
perfectly well he's lying by ommission and allowing Slughorn to 
think he's something that he isn't.

Ronin:
> As far as Harry behaving with nobility.....He's a school boy, not 
the Prime
> Minister.  Between saving the WW each year, dealing with death, 
dementors,
> occlumencey, quiditch and lessons, I think he's demonstrated 
exceptional
> nobility so far and is entitled to make mistakes occasionally. 

Magpie:
Sure--which is why, imo, his mistakes or less than noble intentions 
don't have to be polished into something else. Harry enjoys having 
an unfair advantage over the other kids in his class, and finds it 
more convenient to have Slughorn thinking he's a Potions genius like 
his mother. 

-m