[HPforGrownups] Re: On the trivial and the profound/Dumbledore's attitude

[Magpie]

No: HPFGUIDX 165484

 "sistermagpie" Wrote:
>
>> I don't think seeing Harry's faking
>> his ability at Potions as dishonest
>> has to come from a love of criticizing Harry.

Eggplant:
> Don't be silly, of course people love to criticize Harry! Do you
> honestly think this thread would be one tenth as long as it is if
> Draco had done it, or Snape? And Harry wasn't faking; he really could
> make better potions than anybody else in the class.

Magpie:
I don't really know what people would be saying if Draco or Snape had done 
it--perhaps you would be among those in the thread saying it was a bad thing 
if Snape or Draco did it, but that really doesn't matter. What you feel 
about how people like or don't like to criticize the characters doesn't 
change that sometimes people judge situations differently than you do. It 
doesn't have to be because they just love to criticize Harry no matter what 
or have something against him.

No one is accusing Harry of not making his own Potions. Harry himself knows 
that he's covering up something. He knows Slughorn thinks he's better at it 
and knows more than he does. Since this is something he shouldn't be guilty 
of at all, according to you, I don't know why it should be terrible to say 
it out loud. If it's so important that Harry really be as good at Potions as 
Slughorn thinks he is so he isn't lying at all, too bad he's not. He's just 
passively allowing somebody to think something about him he knows is untrue. 
I don't think that's so harsh a criticism. He might be working to cover that 
up with Slughorn, but he doesn't seem to be telling himself any different.

Eggplant:
 Harry has forgiven Ron so I guess
> I should too, but what I want to know is, did Ron get that free
> pass from the same place that Snape did? What do Snape and
> Ron have in common?

Magpie:
Based on what you've just said I'd say I think the question of how Ron gets 
a free pass lies more with you than it does with readers or the book, 
because as you've described it here and elsewhere "free pass" is bound up 
with your personal reactions to situations in canon not matching with 
someone else's. So what Snape and Ron have in common is that they bother you 
more than they bother some (but not all) other people.  The same is true 
when people say "How come people are so quick to criticize the Slytherins 
and say they're evil when Harry/the Twins/Hermione/whoever gets a free pass 
when they do something bad?" It's not an objective question, because "free 
pass" is usually a way of describing a reaction to a character other people 
have that one thinks is undeserved. I've seen Ron totally villified for the 
fight in GoF, predicted to be a traitor, a monster, etc. so I think this, 
like every other opinion about every character, is shared by quite a few 
people.

Valky:
"For the Last Time" said Harry, speaking in a slightly hoarse whisper after 
three quarters of an hour silence, "I am not giving back this book, I've 
learned more from the Half-Blood Prince than Snaepe or
Slughorn have taught me in -"
**Harry is cut of by Hermione**
--Ch 15 HBP--

Which clearly demonstrates Harry's concious intent to learn, not merely copy 
for the sake of academic credit, from the notes in the book.

Magpie:
I think everyone acknowledges that Harry wants the book to learn from--he's 
just not interested in learning Potions theory from it. He's learning lots 
of spells and other things. The book is very valuable. Harry's experience in 
Potions class is just a side-effect of that.

Valky:
Another benefit of Harry using the HBP's notes which hasn't been noted 
before is that it prevented Draco the only major contender besides Hermione, 
from winning the Felix elicis at his first Potions lesson,
imbibing the lot and managing to kill Dumbledore before Harry had even heard 
of Merope Gaunt, let alone a Horcrux. FWIW.

Magpie:
Ah, but who's to say that wouldn't have been better for Draco if he won it? 
"Luck" would not necessarily have led him to killing Dumbledore, especially 
since his heart wasn't in the task. Perhaps FF would have given Draco a 
lucky break that would have led to a better solution. Luck's tricky that 
way.:-)

> Magpie:
> I don't see that it really matters whether an academic advantage is
foremost
> in Harry's mind when he does it. It seems like you're whole argument
is that
> things like academic honesty are petty when you're a guy like Harry
who's
> got the weight of the world on his shoulders. And that's a possible
> position, but these things being "petty" in Harry's eyes doesn't mean
> Harry's not taking the easy way over the right way in his Potions
class
> sixth year.

Lupinlore:
Ahhh, right versus easy, the babbling of Dumbledore <g>.  Yet, what kind of 
messages is the "epitome of goodness" giving Harry with regard to Sluggy?

Magpie:
LOL! Hey, I've been trying to find an actual example of right versus easy 
(where "right" doesn't totally coincide with our hero's nature and so what 
they want to do anyway) for two books now. Throw me a bone here! Since 
Dumbledore is pretty much pushing Harry to go use any means necessary on 
Slughorn to get the memory, I've got to look for my own examples of what he 
preaches rather than practices. If I waited for Dumbledore to actually give 
Harry the kind of basic lessons most kids get I'd be out of luck.

-m