Dumbledore's Secret 'All Along' Plan?

[horridporrid03]

No: HPFGUIDX 163650

> >>Penny Bee:
> <snip>
> I myself had been of the mind that Dumbledore:
> 1)  was aware of LV's existence, and his plans to reemerge

Betsy Hp:
I totally agree that Dumbledore knew Voldemort wasn't *completely* 
dead yet.  We have Hagrid quoting Dumbldore in PS/SS regarding 
Voldemort not being dead, and Dumbledore obviously went through a lot 
of trouble to make Harry as untouchable as wizardly possible while a 
vulnerable child.

Also, Dumbledore knew the full prophecy, and it hadn't been fulfilled 
after that first attack.  Only part one, the marking, had occured.  
So, while I don't think Dumbledore had any definite ideas (probably a 
lot of theories) about *how* Voldemort would emerge, I'm quite sure 
Dumbledore did his best to prepare for it happening.

> >>Penny Bee:
> 2)  was aware of LV's thoughts about Harry, and the danger against 
> Harry

Betsy Hp:
Again, Dumbledore knew the prophecy, knew Voldemort knew part of the 
prophecy, so he'd know that Harry'd be Voldemort's number one 
target.  (Gosh, even without the prophecy I don't think Voldemort 
would be capable of ignoring the "one that got away".)

> >>Penny Bee:
> 3)  had some idea about the horcruxes, and has been piecing        
> together the evidence since COS

Betsy Hp:
I don't think Dumbledore was sure about (or possibly even leaning 
towards) horcruxes until the end of CoS.  I'd be surprised if a 
horcrux wasn't one of the many theories Dumbledore was tossing around 
in his mind, but it's not until he saw the destroyed diary that he 
realized this was the method.  I think it's after he gets the diary 
that he starts his horcrux hunt.  (Isn't there a quote in HBP saying 
just this?  I should probably grab my books, but I'm too darned lazy 
at the moment... <g>)

> >>Penny Bee;
> 1)  Why would Dumbledore hire Lockhart?
> <snip>
> If you suspect that the most dangerous wizard has a gripe with one 
> of your students (a student you're fond of, as well), why would you 
> hire an incompetent to teach him (and the other students) how to   
> defend himself?

Betsy Hp:
Easy answer is, I think Dumbledore *was* that desperate.  The WW 
isn't that big, so I'm sure Quirrell's death wasn't all that much of 
a secret.  Added on to a job that's been rumored cursed, I can see 
the wiser DADA types among the WW steering clear.

More difficult answer: I'm not sure Dumbledore really thought along 
the lines of Harry ever *dueling* Voldemort.  I mean, he's never 
really emphasized Harry improving his WW martial skills.  Which of 
course leads to the question, why not?  

> 2)  Why did Dumbledore agree to hold and host the Triwizard        
> Tournament at Hogwarts?
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
I was always under the impression that Dumbledore was the one who 
raised the idea of doing the Tournament for the purpose of uniting 
the various members of the European WW against Voldemort.  (Isn't 
there a quote where Dumbledore says something just like that in 
GoF... still too lazy.)

It was a calculated risk, I suppose.  And a real Moody was supposed 
to be a helping hand, I think.  It's just unfortunate that he's the 
one who got taken.

> >>Penny Bee:
> I won't even go into the whole occlumency with Snape fiasco--even 
> Dumbledore admits it was a bad idea.
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
Hind sight? Yeah it was.  Going into it?  Dumbledore did ask one of 
his better teachers, one of his more trusted Order members, and one 
of the better practitioners of Occlumency to teach Harry a rather 
arcane art.  Dumbledore underestimated the animosity Harry and Snape 
had for each other.  (It wouldn't surprise me if he thought throwing 
Snape and Harry together might not help end that animosity. Kind of 
like putting two fighting kids in detention together.)  But since 
Dumbledore doesn't seem to get that passionate himself about those he 
dislikes (not even Voldemort raises Dubmledore's ire) I think it's 
hard for him to put himself in either Snape's or Harry's shoes on 
this issue. 

> >>Penny Bee: 
> So, I'm wondering:  if Dumbledore knew all along about LV's        
> possible plans and the horcruxes, and such, then either:
> 1)  He's making a lot of inexplicable decisions

Betsy Hp:
Eh, if you take Dumbledore as slightly wiser than the average wizard, 
but not of Gandalf, or even Yoda standards (which the books supports, 
I think) than his decisions, for the most part, make a certain amount 
of sense.  You just have to take into consideration that Dumbledore 
doesn't really know everything about what's going on.  I think he's 
often making it up on the fly, personally.

> >>Penny Bee:
> 2)  He's purposefully trying to get Harry to LV
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
Actually, I think one of Dumbledore's biggest weaknesses is he's 
overprotective of Harry.  He tries to keep Harry off the playing 
field and tucked into "normal school boy" mode.  I believe Dumbledore 
says as much at the end of OotP.

[My one issue with this way of looking at Dumbledore is PS/SS.  I 
have a way of looking at that particular book so Dumbledore's 
character makes sense, but it's unfortunately unsupported in future 
books -- except in the sense that Dumbledore remains a consistent 
character...  Which makes me sad, I'll admit.]

> >>Penny Bee:
> 3)  He was using Harry as bait to draw LV out, where the Order can 
> get him.  Didn't work, but now Harry is old enough to handle things 
> (maybe).

Betsy Hp:
Nah... I can't buy this one either.  Not unless Dumbledore is 
supposed to turn out evil in the end (which I sooo don't see 
happening).  For one, Dumbledore isn't setting the Order up to take 
on Voldemort; none of them know about the horcruxes.  For another 
Dumbledore does his best to keep Harry *away* from Voldemort (except 
for PS/SS, which again is a problem).  Until HBP of course, when 
Dumbledore finally decides it's time for Harry to step onto the field.

> >>Penny Bee:
> There must be more ideas.  Any thoughts, anyone?

Betsy Hp:
For me the key to Dumbledore is this: he's never been the "bearded 
guy" before.  He's been the hero, and he did a great job at it and 
still has his fans.  But this thing with Harry is brand new for him.  
And, as per Dumbledore himself, he found himself *not* wanting Harry 
to take on the role of hero.  Dumbledore wanted to keep Harry as a 
school boy, no matter what Voldemort wanted.

So I do think Dumbledore is making a lot of this up while he goes 
along.  I think most of the twists in the various books take him by 
complete surprise.  So mistakes were made.  Of course they were 
made.  Dumbledore managed to keep things from falling into complete 
disaster because he's pretty smart, but he's had to scramble like a 
mad man to do so.  IMO, anyway.

(PS/SS remains a problem.  And that bugs me.  It really, really does. 
<g>

Betsy Hp (posting this waay too late so it probably makes no sense, 
but I've worked on this on and off all night, gosh darn it, so I'm 
posting it...)