very basic confusion

[justcarol67]

No: HPFGUIDX 163735

bboyminn:
> 
> Remember that the conversation Geoff references occurred
> long after Voldemort's downfall and equally long after
> the Prophecy was made. By the time Dumbledore has this
> conversation with Harry, the Prophecy has already been
> made, Voldemort has already attacked Harry, 10 years have
> passed, and Harry has come to Hogwarts and has been 
> involved in many heroic events. 
> 
> Dumbledore is not making his decision based on just the
> Prophecy, he is basing it on many many events that have
> occurred after the Prophecy was made. At the time 
> Dumbledore makes his statement (referenced by Geoff), it
> is VERY clear that Harry is the 'Chosen One'.
> 
> Notice that it is not Dumbledore who makes the 
> arrangements to protect the Potters. They make their
> own choices and their own protective arrangements. They
> cast their own Secret Keeper Charm.
> 
> I can only assume that reasonably Dumbledore make the
> information about the Prophecy available to both the
> Potters and the Longbottoms. He certainly also offerred
> to help them. The Potters made their choice about how
> to respond to the Prophecy and the Longbottoms made their
> choice about how to protect themselves. Dumbledore's
> offer to assist was very likely made to both families. 
> 
> My point is that before the events occurred they could
> /not/ know that Harry was the Chosen One, only that he 
> might be. But when Voldemort attacked Harry, by virtue of
> that attack, Harry was made the Chosen One. Based on what
> Dumbledore observes of Harry's selflessness and heroic
> actions, it becomes clear beyond any doubt that Harry is
> indeed the Chosen One, but that is after the fact. Before
> Voldemort's attack no one knew with any certainty which
> kid Voldemort would choose. 
> 
> 
> > Aki continues:
> >
> > And how Volde came to know that prophecy was about some
> > child who is not yet born? Most expected guess one can
> > made, which relates (unknown) prophecy and downfall of 
> > Volde that it can be none other than DD.
> >
> >Can you please clear my doubts?
> 
> bboyminn:
> 
> Snape told Voldemort about the Prophecy, though, according
> to the books, Snape only heard the first part of the
> Prophecy. From what Snape told Voldemort, he had enough
> information to conclude that it was about a child that
> was about to be born in at the end of the next up coming
> month of July. 
> 
> Now, the Prophecy doesn't specify a year. It could have 
> been a child born this year, next year, or ten years from
> now, but a reasonable interpretation is that it means the
> next up coming month of July. 
> 
> Regardless of what the /correct/ interpretation of the
> Prophecy was, Voldemort gathered the information and
> made his choices, and those choices /created/ a correct
> interpretation of the Prophecy. In a sense, Voldemort's
> own actions made it a self-fulfilling Prophecy. 
>
Carol adds:
I agree with Steve (bboyminn). We, the readers, have the benefit of
hindsight in interpreting the Prophecy (and we still don't agree on
all its aspects). Voldemort *chose to interpret* the Prophecy to refer
to an unborn baby boy. "Born as the seventh month dies" could perhaps
have referred to any wizard (or witch) born at the end of July in any
year, but "born to those who have thrice defied him" more or less
narrowed it down to the child of an Order member. Voldemort was
already systematically killing off Order members, but he may have
begun to focus on married couples with pregnant wives at that point.
When the birth announcements for July were published in the Daily
Prophet in early August 1980, there would have been only two babies
who met Voldemort's criteria (male and born at the end of July to
Order members). Muggleborns, whose names would not appear in the Daily
Prophet, would have been discounted as not having parents who had
thrice defied him. Once Voldemort had interpreted the Prophecy in that
way, he had only two boys to choose from. He chose the half-blood
rather than the pure-blood, in part, perhaps, from the resemblance to
himself; in part, perhaps, because a July 31 birthday fit the Prophecy
better than a July 30 birthday. (I don't doubt, though, that he
intended to kill Neville, and perhaps his parents, for good measure.)

Once Snape realized how Voldemort *chose* to interpret the Prophecy,
he reported the Potters' danger (and perhaps that of the Longbottoms)
to Dumbledore. But apparently the conclusion that it referred to an
unborn child was not self-evident, and even the sex of the "one with
the power to defeat the Dark Lord" is unspecified in the part of the
Prophecy that Voldemort heard. He seems to have assumed, correctly,
that the "one" must be male (as revealed in the second part of the
Prophecy).

At any rate, I agree with Aki that the identity of the Chosen One is
not self-evident from the Prophecy and with Steve that once Voldemort
chose to interpret the Prophecy as referring to a boy who would be
born at the end of the following July, the candidates were reduced to
Harry and Neville. By choosing Harry over Neville, Voldemort in
essence created his own nemesis, "marking Harry as his equal" and
giving him some of his powers. The Prophecy might never have come true
if Voldemort hadn't attempted to thwarted and consequently brought
part of the unheard second half of the Prophecy to pass. (More irony,
if you've been reading my posts on that topic.)

Carol, who suggests a thorough rereading of all six books in sequence
if Aki is still confused