Victory for TEWWW EWWW?? Snape the hero

[leslie41]

No: HPFGUIDX 173190

Nora:
Where I find Rowling's comments useful is in what I like to think of
as a calculus of effort regarding interpretation. Step back a few
books to pre-OotP (what a fun time that was onlist!). At this time,
Snapetheories ran wild, and many of them were devoted to explaining
his seemingly nasty behavior to the students as part of a plan,
something with an explicit reason.

Now, this takes some work. You have to strap a lot of "this is what
is in the text, BUT this is what it will actually be revealed as being
a part of..." onto things. At the time, this was work worth doing, in
part because there were several books to go and a few reveals would do
a lot. Unfortunately, what's come around now is that given the lack
of a reveal, the amount of work starts to seem (to me) superfluous.
It reminds me of a student doing analysis on something with a
relatively steady style like Handel and coming up with strange chords
that take a lot of work to explain, while if you read it in a
different key, it's very easy.

Leslie41:
That's an interesting point.  The essay I linked to yesterday by 
Orson Scott Card is fascinating because it posits that Rowling 
herself didn't know much about Snape, or certainly about his role in 
the end, when she began the book.  I'll link it again here, because 
it's the very best piece of writing I've ever read about Snape's 
character, bar none.  Not unsurprising, considering who wrote it.  

http://www.intergalacticmedicineshow.com/cgi-bin/mag.cgi?
do=issue&vol=i5&article=_card-essay

Nora:
<snip>
It manifestly depends on your definition of heroism, which I think is
all that Rowling was saying in the first place--that she didn't see
him as a hero, especially within the framework she constructed in the
novels.

Leslie41:
That's fine for her.  She can think what she likes. But her voice 
will not be the most important one to determine the meaning of her 
work.  I would say that Snape is a hero in the framework she's 
constructed.    

Lupinlore:
So, you would be saying that JKR is deluding herself about her own
character? Perfectly possible I suppose. Nevertheless, it does strike
me as an example of the phenomenon you have decried before -- i.e. a
complete and steadfast refusal to acknowledge any statement or 
evidence that does not match with your preferred take on Snape's 
character.

Leslie41:
Actually, authors, even the best among them, very often delude 
themselves about their characters. I think the analogy between a 
parent and a child is very apt. Mediocre authors, as we all know, are 
often incredibly deluded about the relative merits of their own 
work.  Even authors roundly accepted as superior are not reliable 
commentators on their own work.  That, I would assert, is pretty much 
an accepted fact.   

As for defending Snape, I think I have a very reasonable view of 
him.  Some have decried Lily, blaming her for "abandoning" him, for 
not being "there" for him or accepting his apology.  I think what 
Lily did was perfectly correct. I'm fully willing to acknowledge 
Snape's many failures, bad deeds, surliness, etc.
  
But may I ask, *Lupinlore*, when can we be expecting your latest 
evaluation of Lupin's character?  You know, the Lupin that prowls the 
grounds of Hogwarts as a teenager, month after month, endangering his 
fellow students despite the fact that he's already had many close 
calls? The Lupin that marries Tonks, gets her pregnant, and then 
complains about it, making even Harry himself sick to his stomach?  
The Lupin that, er
Severus Snape *saves*.  Oh, Lupin is nice.  I 
would much prefer him as a friend.  Would like to be his friend, if 
such a thing were possible (I don't think I could say that about 
Snape).  But Lupin makes these kinds of mistakes again and again and 
keeps making them, until the very end of the series.  Snape is nasty 
to his students, but Lupin, by his own admission, puts them in mortal 
danger, both as a student himself and later as a teacher.  Nothing 
I'm saying about him is something he would not agree with himself.  
Just before he goes out and does it all again, of course.  That's 
Lupin.    

And so long as you elevate Lupin, and post criticism of Snape under 
that name, I am unfortunately forced to conclude that you have failed 
to systematically analyze and accept what an weak, cowardly failure 
his deeds often prove him to be.  Not always.  He dies well.  But 
often. And I will take any criticism of Snape that you have to make 
in that vein.