On Children and the "Other" (was:Re: On the perfection of moral virt

[horridporrid03]

No: HPFGUIDX 169639

> >>Betsy Hp:
> > And that is something the Trio has shown they don't have a grasp 
> > of yet. Marietta, for example, has been punished without  benefit 
> > of a trial. Hermione removed Marietta's right. IOWs, as per      
> > Hermione, Hermione is more equal than Marietta, because Marietta 
> > is  "other" and not quite as human as Hermione is.

> >>Nikkalmati:
> Can you possibly explain how Marietta could have been given a      
> trial?   

Betsy Hp:
Hermione's a clever girl, I'm sure she'd have thought of something. 
<g>  And that's the flippant answer.

More seriously, if you're going to condemn someone to be branded 
across their face, quite possibly for life, at least for a rather 
long period of time, and you don't give them a chance to argue 
against it, you are a tyrant.  And tyrants definitely see themselves 
as more equal than others.

> >>Nikkalmati:
> Besides this is not a matter of breaking a law, unless it is the   
> law of the playground.

Betsy Hp:
Yes.  A law Hermione has broken herself a time or two.

> >>Nikkalmati:
> We have been told in other threads that the worst thing one  can do 
> at this age is rat on your friends (and I wrote a post expressing  
> the opinion that the real theme of the books is loyalty not         
> love).

Betsy Hp:
One may only claim the "innocence" of childhood if one's retaliation 
retains the innocence of childhood.  You start branding other people 
on the face, you've lost your "I'm just a kid!" pass.  IMO, anyway.

When Harry and Ron shunned Hermione after she snitched on them in PoA 
they were operating within the "school yard" arena.  But when 
Hermione put a secret curse on a parchment for the purpose of base 
vengence, she'd left the school yard far behind her.  IMO.

> >>Nikkalmati:
> Marietta did that and exposed her friends or at least her "friend" 
> Cho and  a lot of people she knew to expulsion.
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
Who are the quotes meant for?  Cho or Marietta?  I'm pretty sure 
they're supposed to genuinely like each other.  Cho has certainly 
shown herself loyal.  Frankly, I think Marietta has shown herself 
loyal as well in that she doesn't appear to blame Cho for the mess 
she's in.

> >>Nikkalmati:
> Everyone in the DA knew they were taking that risk by the time  the 
> group had met.  Hermione was not self-appointed judge, jury and     
> executioner.  She set a trap.  Anyone who set it off was clearly    
> guilty of a violation of the contract.

Betsy Hp:
It's funny how close Harry came to springing the trap himself.  (At 
this point, I wish he had.  Might have been nice for the Trio to get 
a little taste of their own medicine.)  But Hermione was *exactly* a 
self-appointed judge, jury and executioner.  She was just really, 
really secretive about it.  Because she knew best.  And because none 
of the other kids were really real to her.  (Of the Trio, I think 
Hermione is the one who honestly has the hardest time seeing other 
people as valid.)

> >>Nikkalmati:
> <snip>  
> I don't see any real excuse for Marietta.
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
Of course you don't.  Marietta was never given a chance to provide 
one.  Cho tried, but Harry refused to listen.

> >>Nikkalmati:
> It is not fair to  look at the DA as a study group, regardless of   
> what some of the members  thought.  We know it is a strike against 
> LV and an attempt to save the  world. It was an emergency          
> situation. 

> >>Goddlefrood:
> <snip>
> The WW most probably would have been similar in that when a state  
> of emergency is declared basic rights and freedoms that might      
> otherwise be taken for granted fly out of the window.
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
The thing is, the WW has been in a constant state of emergency since 
they first went underground, taking their beasts and insects with 
them.  The main purpose of the MoM is to keep the WW secret, to keep 
it safe.  So *of course* the natural state of things is paranoia and 
a deep, deep distrust and fear of "others". (This may explain why 
there is so little of the humanities and arts and sciences in the WW.)

On the most basic level, for wizards the "others" are muggles.  And 
as Arthur Weasley has told us, wizards have long felt that muggles 
were and are "lesser than".  That belief is propagated within the 
school itself, as exemplified by the different policies followed when 
an injured student has muggle parents or wizard parents.  (Hermione 
is the poster-girl for firmly identifing with one side and rejecting 
the "other".  She barely sees her parents at all and apparently lies 
to them the few times they do get together.)

But the wizards are also cut off from each other.  As we see with the 
Weasleys, families stick with each other, their children not 
socializing until arrival at Hogwarts.  And Hogwarts further 
seperates wizards from each other with their House system.

So we've got this society that's *always* in a state of emergency for 
some reason or another.  They're encouraged to distrust and fear 
anyone that might be different from them.  It's no wonder the Trio 
have yet to learn any kind of tolerance or empathy.  They've been 
encouraged to do the opposite.  "Trust no one" is the WW mantra.  

No wonder Voldemort found it such fertile ground for his campaign of 
fear and distruction.  With very little prodding on his part the WW 
is *eager* to turn on each other and rip and claw until only the most 
brutal is left standing.  The Trio are no exception. Yet.

Which is why (as I think houyhnhnm pointed out?) the WW seems doomed 
to always have a Dark Lord, and which is why the DA fell completely 
apart after the study group part of it was no longer needed.  Unity 
cannot be achieved where distrust dominates.

Betsy Hp