Snape - a werewolf bigot?? Was: Say it isn't so Lupin!!!

[Zara]

No: HPFGUIDX 170151

> Dana:
> Tell me is glimpsing Lupin at the end of the tunnel really plenty 
of 
> experience for Snape to understand how deadly a werewwolf can be? 
> Because to me it is a little overrated as he never had a deadly 
> struggle for his life as a result. Lupin never came within striking 
> range of Snape. To me Snape is just brooding on the "what if" and 
not 
> on what he actually experienced. He is not calling Lupin a werewolf 
> out of his own experience and out of his own fear but because he 
> still believes Lupin was part of the trick Sirius played on him. 

zgirnius:
It is in my opinion debatable, but there is definitely evidence 
favoring the idea that James Potter saved Snape's life in that 
incident, and that Snape had a consequent life debt to James. None of 
this could have happened if Snape's life were not threatened in that 
incident.

We have also Lupin's statement, which is sort of self-contradictory, 
so one must choose which parts to believe:

> PoA:
> your father, who'd heard what Sirius had done, went after Snape and 
pulled him back, at great risk to his life... Snape glimpsed me, 
though, at the end of the tunnel. 

zgirnius:
Either Snape (and therefore Potter) only barely glimpsed Lupin at the 
end of the tunnel and skedaddled (which you seem to propose), or 
James acted 'at great risk to his life', in which case, since Snape 
was further into the tunnel, we must conclude Snape's life was at 
least equally at risk.

I tend to the interpretation that both Snape and Potter were in real, 
tangible danger, because I can't really see, psychologically, why 
James's rescue would rankle so if Snape had not needed him. Surely at 
the point at which Snape saw the werewolf, he could just turn around 
and walk back out, if Lupin were indeed far away and no threat?

> Dana:
> If he truly was scared then he would not have mocked Lupin about 
his 
> problem all year long and he certainly would not have run after him 
> to the shack. 

zgirnius:
Why not? First, he did not mock Lupin about the problem that I can 
recall prior to the Shack scene. In my opinion, his evident desire to 
see Lupin drink his potion in the scene Harry sees could be 
attributed to fear/worry about Lupin transforming without the potion. 
Seeing him take it would certainly be reassuring.

As to the second claim - it is surely not the only potentially 
frightening thing Snape has done. We see the same pallor that is 
described at his appearance in the Shack scene again in GoF, before 
he returns to Voldemort.

> Dana:
> Let me ask you this if Snape was not a true bigot then why did he 
> never reveal that he was not a pure blood? Because as we see Bella 
> calls Harry a filty Half-Blood but she never mentions this to Snape 
> when she is in Spinner's End and I'm sure she would have if she had 
> known this. 

zgirnius:
It is my opinion Snape's blood status is known to his Death Eater 
friends from his schooldays. For one thing, someone like Bella must 
know Snape is not a pureblood name. There aren't many of those old 
families. *If* Snape managed to hide anything, and I see no evidence 
one way or the other, I would guess that would be that his father was 
a Muggle. 

The evidence I see that Bella knows is what she says to Cissy as they 
approach Spinner's End: "We must be the first of our kind ever to set 
foot-". In other words, there is some classification ('our kind') 
Bella has in mind, to which she and Cissy belong, and Snape, who 
lives there and so, obviously, has set foot there before, does not. 
Snape is Death Eater like Bella, he is a wizard like Bella, so what 
do you propose she means? I thought it obvious she meant purebloods 
by 'our kind', meaning she knows Snape is not one.

> Dana:
> Tell me if Snape did not truly 
> think of her as a filthy mudblood then how come it was the first 
> thing that came into his mind. If you do not think about people in 
> such away then it would never enter you mind not even in a 
situation 
> like that. 

zgirnius:
Snape lived among people who used terms like that all the time for at 
least part of his schooldays, among his Slytherin housemates. I don't 
see why it would not occur to him as an insult to use. 

Also, it is by no means obvious that this was the first thing Snape 
thought of:

> OotP:
> 'Leave him ALONE!'

> James and Sirius looked round. James's free hand immediately jumped 
to his hair.

> It was one of the girls from the lake edge. She had thick, dark red 
hair that fell to her shoulders, and startlingly green almond-shaped 
eyes - Harry's eyes.

> Harry's mother.

> 'All right, Evans?' said James, and the tone of his voice was 
suddenly pleasant, deeper, more mature.

> 'Leave him alone,' Lily repeated. She was looking at James with 
every sign of great dislike. 'What's he done to you?'

> 'Well,' said James, appearing to deliberate the point, 'it's more 
the fact that he exists, if you know what I mean
'

> Many of the surrounding students laughed, Sirius and Wormtail 
included, but Lupin, still apparently intent on his book, didn't, and 
nor did Lily.

> 'You think you're funny,' she said coldly. 'But you're just an 
arrogant, bullying toerag, Potter. Leave him alone.'

> 'I will if you go out with me, Evans,' said James quickly. 'Go on
 
go out with me and I'll never lay a wand on old Snivelly again.'

> Behind him, the Impediment Jinx was wearing off. Snape was 
beginning to inch towards his fallen wand, spitting out soapsuds as 
he crawled.

> 'I wouldn't go out with you if it was a choice between you and the 
giant squid,' said Lily.

> 'Bad luck, Prongs,' said Sirius briskly, and turned back to 
Snape. 'OI!'

> But too late; Snape had directed his wand straight at James; there 
was a flash of light and a gash appeared on the side of James's face, 
spattering his robes with blood. James whirled about: a second flash 
of light later, Snape was hanging upside-down in the air, his robes 
falling over his head to reveal skinny, pallid legs and a pair of 
greying underpants.

> Many people in the small crowd cheered; Sirius, James and Wormtail 
roared with laughter.

> Lily, whose furious expression had twitched for an instant as 
though she was going to smile, said, 'Let him down!'

> 'Certainly,' said James and he jerked his wand upwards; Snape fell 
into a crumpled heap on the ground. Disentangling himself from his 
robes he got quickly to his feet, wand up, but Sirius 
said, 'Petrificus Totalus!' and Snape keeled over again, rigid as a 
board.

> 'LEAVE HIM ALONE!' Lily shouted. She had her own wand out now. 
James and Sirius eyed it warily.

'Ah, Evans, don't make me hex you,' said James earnestly.

> Take the curse off him, then!'

> James sighed deeply, then turned to Snape and muttered the counter-
curse.

> There you go,' he said, as Snape struggled to his feet. 'You're 
lucky Evans was here, Snivellus -'

> 'I don't need help from filthy little Mudbloods like her!'

zgirnius:
The point of this extremely long excerpt? Its length. All this 
happens between the moment Lily shows up, and Snape insults her.