Neither Harry nor his Scar is a Horcrux (Was Re: Voldemort's Age)

[Jen Reese]

No: HPFGUIDX 170390

> Jen previous:
> I'd say it all comes back to the prophecy.  If Harry is marked as
> Voldemort's equal and 'either must die at the hand of the other'
> that means they should be equitable (except for the 'power the Dark 
> Lord knows not').  As a Horcrux, Harry would be acting as an anchor 
> for Voldemort and keeping him from being killed but Harry wouldn't 
> be equal to him in this way. <snip>

> Carol:
> Exactly. Which pretty much destroys the Harry!Horcrux argument right
> there. 

Jen:  If Harry is a Horcrux anchoring Voldemort then I don't see them 
as equal, no, but that's just me - JKR may have a different 
intepretation. ;)  However, whatever gives Harry the ability to 'see 
into [LV's] thoughts, his ambitions, that [Harry] even understand 
the snakelike language in which he gives orders...'*, and it seems 
likely to be a soul piece in my view, then sharing part of 
Voldemort's soul strikes me today as the equalizing factor I was 
searching for in my last post.  Harry's ability is a 'privileged 
insight into Voldemort's world' and he is the only person in the WW 
capable of this insight.  

*(HBP, chap. 23, p. 477, UK ed.)

Mike:
> Yet, Voldemort "marking" Harry as his "equal" is not the same thing
> as them being "equals". The prophecy itself says that Harry
> has "power the Dark Lord knows not", which right there says that
> Harry and LV are not "equals". And Voldemort has developed his 
> powers to a degree that Harry may never achieve, some of those 
> powers undoubtedly involve dark magic that Harry wouldn't *want* to 
> develop.

Jen:  I was writing as you posted and see that my paragraph above and 
your first paragraph are compatible, so a big 'I agree' is in order!  
But I wanted to address this section specifically and say I was 
writing about the two yesterday as being equals *up to* the point 
Harry's power is factored into the equation.  Presumably this element 
is the key to Voldemort's vanquishment because it changes the power 
balance in Harry's favor.

Debbie:
> Ahhh, the Prophecy. Since it is a near-certainty that the Prophecy 
> will be fulfilled in some manner, we should evaluate all our 
> theories in its light.  Starting with the portion you quoted, the
> full excerpt reads: ". . . and either must die at the hand of the
> other for neither can live while the other survives . . ." It is 
> the second clause the puzzles me most of all, because obviously
> Harry is alive and -- at some level -- so is Voldemort.  However,
> Harry's life is not fully independent of Voldemort, as the scar 
> connection shows. He feels emotions that re not his. Dumbledore
> tells Harry in OOP: "On those rare occasions when we had close
> contact, I thought I saw a shadow of him stir behind your eyes." 
> And Harry's purity of heart does not mix well with Voldemort's
> evil, causing them both pain.

Jen:  Yes, if living for the story purposes is each person having his 
own thoughts, feelings, choice-making ability, magical powers etc., 
and I'd say those are the major components that make up anyone's 
life :), then neither is living completely on his own as long as the 
connection between them exists.  
 
> Jen:
> Which brings me to what some will think is a very odd 
> conclusion....the possibility that Harry is *also* immortal right 
> now, anchored to Voldemort's Horcruxes because he shares part of 
> Voldemort's soul.  And what power does Harry have that the 'Dark
> Lord knows not'?  The power to love, to be willing to destroy the
> Horcruxes and sacrifice himself if it comes to that in order for 
> Voldemort to be destroyed.  Voldemort *can't* do the same in order
> to destroy Harry because he's never known love.

> Carol:
> But Horcruxes are the antithesis of Love, and being a Horcrux seems
> antithetical to using Love magic to conquer Voldemort. Also, I don't
> see how having a bit of *Voldemort's* soul in him would make Harry
> immortal...
<snip>
> Also, though this may not matter to people who aren't DDM!Snapers,
> Snape's attempts to protect Harry would be stripped of their 
> thematic significance if Harry were immortal. And wouldn't Harry 
> have died from the Basilisk venom if it hadn't been for Fawkes's 
> tears? He certainly didn't seem immortal in that scene?

Jen:  I decided immortality was a silly idea after thinking more 
about it, for the reasons you mention above and also what came into 
my own mind: that the blood protection, all the years at the 
Dursleys, Harry's characterization as an average guy that others can 
relate to and other aspects of Harry's story and Dumbledore's 
protections would be invalidated and rendered almost meaningless.  So 
I dumped that idea -poster's privilege to begin again, hehe. 

Carol:
<snip>
> I expect and hope that the heart of DH will be Harry's emotional
> development, not some magical complication making him the human 
> equivalent of the Hufflepuff Cup. Harry is not a superhero. The 
> whole point of the books is that he's an ordinary wizarding boy 
> with a unique history, one or two unusual powers (Parseltongue and
> a mental link to Voldemort and Love), a lot of luck, a lot of 
> courage and resourcefulness, and loyal friends--a boy who seems to
> be outmatched by his enemy but who will win the conflict through 
> those means, not because he's an accidental Horcrux. Or so I 
> fervently hope.

Jen:  Well, I can nod along with most of your paragraph except for 
Harry being equivalent to Hufflepuff's cup!  I don't think he'll win 
because he has a soul piece; a soul piece would only explain what 
happened at Godric's Hollow and why Harry and Voldemort are connected 
by the scar.  The premise I accept for why Harry will vanquish 
Voldemort is that he possesses a power Voldemort 'has not at all,' 
which makes possible Harry's loyal friendships, the ability to call 
objects and beings/beasts to him when needed most and his willingness 
to sacrifice himself for others.  None of those characteristics come 
from an LV soul piece inside of him but from his own 'untarnished and 
whole' soul.

Jen