Snape's the Rescuer - Really?/Justice to Snape

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 170699

> Julie:
> So glad you're amused. Of course, NO ONE fully understands the 
Prophecy,
> including the readers, since JKR purposely wrote it ambiguously. 
And if  Snape
> really didn't hear all of it, how could he possibly understand all 
its  
> implications?

Alla:

Yes I am amused when I read this argument. And one may not fully 
understand the prophecy, but I am yet to find one reader ( they may 
exist of course, just I was not able to find yet) who does not 
realize that the one with the power to destroy Lordie Voldie 
approaches.

So, yes, I expect no less from Snape.


Julie:
> Please note, I never said Snape assumed someone couldn't or 
wouldn't  get
> hurt if he told Voldemort about the Prophecy. 

Alla:

Good :)

Julie:
My point is that we don't  know
> that Snape thought he was turning over a BABY for execution, since 
he  could
> have easily assumed Voldemort might monitor the situation to see 
if a  child
> appeared to be turning into a threat.

Alla:

And my point is that I do not understand why Snape would ever make 
an assumption that Voldemort would monitor the situation to check 
and see whether threat is real or not. Sounds totally out of 
character for Voldemort to me and I think should sound out of 
character to Snape as well.


Julie:
 And while it's not likely Voldemort  
> would
> postpone hunting someone he considers an enemy<snip>--we don't 
know that Voldemort  
> ever
> hunted babies or children specifically, since he would have no 
reason  to 
> consider
> them any magical threat to him at all. 
<SNIPPED for details>


Alla:

Yes, precisely he targets his enemies right away, so why would 
anybody think that he would consider postponing targeting baby?

  
  
> Alla:
> What exactly may lead Snape to believe that Voldemort would not  
act 
> right away? Goodness of his heart? Voldemort's I mean?
> 
> Julie:
> As I said before, because Voldemort doesn't *have* to act right  
away. He has
> lots of other immediate threats to deal with. Why bother with a  
baby that can
> do no magic, and won't be able to do so with any reliability for 
many  years? 

Alla:

It is stated that this baby would have the power to destroy him - 
sounds as the first order of business to me. IMO.



   
> Alla:
> And we do believe Dumbledore, yes? Or we only believe Dumbledore 
when  
> he *trusts Severus Snape* and do not believe him when he brings 
up  
> information that does not sound sooo good for Snape?
>  
> Julie: 
> Or some of us apparently believe the opposite ;-) Seriously, I do  
believe
> Dumbledore *both* times. It's possible to do so. Snape as a DE  
relaying
> information to a known killer doesn't look sooo good any way you  
slice
> it. 

Alla:

Oh, I believe Dumbledore in both situations all right. I am pretty 
sure that he **thought** he had a good reasons to **trust Severus 
Snape**
 
> Julie:
> I missed where someone said he was "kind." 

Alla:

Um, I often make reply to thread in general, when I reply to 
particular post, sometimes I specify it, sometimes I forget. Sorry 
about that. But it was said that Snape was **kind** in putting 
Sirius  and kids on stretchers. I will hunt for this post if needed, 
I am almost positive it was Carol's, just do not remember which one.


Julie:
His action was simply  that
> of a decent human being. He could have acted indecently, by 
leaving  them,
> by kicking Sirius in the head a couple of times (not so different 
than  Sirius
> banging *his* levitating body against the tunnel walls out of 
spite), or he  
> could
> have summoned the Dementors to suck Sirius's soul, and claimed he 
was
> still unconscious while it happened. He could have done any number 
of
> petty things while he assumed he wasn't being watched. 
<SNIP>


Alla:

Him acting in this situation as decent human being is debatable. I 
wrote in the past on WW being allowed to use deadly force against 
Sirius - specifically I found no such indications in canon.

So to me, Snape bringing Sirius to the castle is doing what he would 
love to do without risking an Azkaban for murder attempt. He knows 
that  Black would be brought to dementors without further trial, he 
**hopes** that Dumbledore will not interfere. That is not how decent 
human being acts to me.


> colebiancardi:
> 
> found it!!  No OOOPSIE for you!!  pg 387-388 AmEd Hardcover PoA
<SNIP of the quote>
> Well, I don't *know* why Snape bound & gagged Sirius when Sirius 
was
> out cold, but then again, Snape also tells the whopper of the Trio
> being under Sirius' Confundus Charm.  I can only think that Snape 
is
> embellishing here.  Ironic, as he accuses the Trio of having 
a "rather
> high opinion of themselves", and I view Snape, during his give & 
take
> with Fudge, in the same way.  


Alla:

Thanks dear :) Yes, the fact that he gagged **unconscious** man 
suggest to me that Snape may have been really unwilling that 
authorities would hear Black story. I mean, really maybe he hoped 
that Sirius would be brought to Dementors gagged for all I know. 

Thank goodness that Dumbledore finally decided to talk to Sirius 
thirteen years later.


> colebiancardi:
> 
> I didn't say  Snape treated Sirius "nicely", lord knows!!  I said 
that
> Sirius received better treatment when he was out cold from Snape 
than
> Snape received at the hands of Sirius.  
> <SNIP>

Alla:

See what I said to Julie. I tend to reply to the thread in general 
and sometimes forget to specify. Sorry about that.

Oh, and sure if you mean better treatment before delivering him to 
be kissed, I agree with that. It is just I cannot grasp how the end 
result of what Snape was going to do can be called better treatment 
IMO.


Colebiancardi:
> Again, how Snape perceives Sirius is no different than anyone else 
in
> the Wizarding World up to that point.  Dumbledore believed it for 
12
> years, until Harry told him the events that had happened.  So, I am
> not going to hold it against Snape, not in this case.  


Alla:

Snape gagging unconscious man is suspicious to me as I said before. 
If Snape believed what whole WW did, I will not hold it against him, 
but if Snape figured it out - whether when he stood and listened or 
before, then he is, well, sink even lower in my mind, if it is 
possible.


JMO,

Alla