CHAPDISC: HBP30, The White Tomb

[cdayr]

No: HPFGUIDX 165721

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "a_svirn" 
<a_svirn at ...> wrote:
>
<snip fabulous summary and selected questions below>
> 
> Questions:
>  
> 2.	What do you think of Bill's part-transformation? Do you find 
> it sinister? 

I don't find Bill's transformation sinister, but I do find his attack by 
Greyback while in human form to be extremely troubling for the 
future of werewolf prejudice and legislation. I sincerely hope 
Lupin gets to take down Fenrir in DH. I actually find him one of 
the most terrifying of the "monsters" that JKR has created, 
because he has such remorseless blood lust. To me, the fact of 
this type of attack on Bill is what is sinister, but not the results. 
Really, the part-transformation idea is actually very interesting- I 
hope we get to see the effects in action during a big battle 
sequence in DH. 

> 4.	It has been discussed extensively, but still. Is Harry right 
> in thinking that Snape followed the same pattern as 
Voldemort? Does 
> proclaiming oneself a Half-Blood Prince mean renouncing 
one's muggle 
> heritage? 

This name, to me, sounds like something Snape would have 
kept very much to himself. He would not want his Slytherin 
buddies so acutely aware of his blood status. Based on his 
memories of the hooked man and the cowering woman in OotP, 
it seems to me that "Half-Blood Prince" is more of a very sad 
attempt by Teen!Snape to separate himself from his father, 
muggle or not, rather than from his muggle heritage. That he 
may have generalized about muggles based on his unpleasant 
or abusive father could be one of the driving forces behind his 
recruitment into the Death Eaters.  Overall I think of these two 
men (Tom and Severus) as having only very surface similarities 
(in fact, Harry and Tom have more in common than Sev and 
Tom), and this will be another of the lessons Harry will have to 
learn about Snape in DH.

Side-bar: Sometimes I wonder if what Harry hates in Snape is 
that he sees in Snape one of the possible end-results of his own 
life path. In order to follow what he believes in, Snape has had to 
cut off emotional ties to everyone around him, and become a 
bitter and isolated man (this is true for DDM or ESE Snape). He 
has had to study intensely and become more and more 
secretive about his true self. The progression of Harry's life 
through the books is leading him to a similar fate in some ways- 
trying to get emotionally tough, cutting himself off from his friends 
or losing them to death, needing to become stronger and wiser 
than those around him, more cunning and more secretive.  The 
difference (or one of the differences, there are many
) is that 
Harry has Ron and Hermione, who won't let him insolate himself 
to the level Snape has. Nonetheless, like most relationships 
where two people just rub each other the wrong way, Snape and 
Harry have a variety of things in common, and I think more and 
more in common as Harry gets older. End side-bar.


> 5.	Do you agree with Hermione that Snape held his peace 
about 
> the book only because by exposing Harry he would inevitably 
expose 
> himself? 
> 6.	Why does Hermione object to the word "evil"? Incidentally, 
> the words she actually uses can be at best described as 
> understatements – "nasty sense of humour" indeed! Why is 
she being so 
> guarded? 

Hermione, as one of the voices of JKR in the series, is not ready 
to condemn Snape as thoroughly as Harry is ("evil" etc.), which is 
a signal to me, the reader, that much more is to come about 
Snape, and that Harry's "black and white" read of the situation is 
far too simple. 
I've thought a lot about Snape's actions after the Sectumsempra, 
because he Has To Know that Harry has found his old book, but 
I find it hard to believe that Snape would actually be worried that 
Dumbledore would find out he had invented a dark spell- he 
was a Death Eater for goodness sake! So why not get more 
aggressive about finding the book? 
I wonder if Snape's pride may have been involved here
after all, 
Potter's success in Potions he now knows is entirely because of 
him, and the opportunity to reveal that fact and lord it over Harry at 
a later, and more public, date may be his goal. No canon for this, 
but just supposition based on my understanding of Snape. Of 
course, Snape does just that eventually, although I doubt that it 
was his original plan to tell Harry while escaping from Hogwart's 
<g>.


> 8.	We are specifically told that this is the first funeral Harry 
> has ever attended. Can we judge of the death rites in the 
Potterverse 
> by this ceremony? Since Hagrid wanted to bury Aragog in order 
give 
> him "a proper send-off", one can assume that for Hagrid, at 
least, 
> burial is the proper way of disposition of the dead. Do wizards 
> usually bury their dead or do they usually cremate them?  

This question just raised the question for me- didn't Harry attend 
Aragog's funeral? What was that, if not a funeral? Why does 
Harry dismiss it? A little human-centric bias there I think! And I'm 
sad to think that he was not present at some sort of ceremony for 
his parents, even as a young baby- one can only hope Petunia 
and Vernon would attend, but I guess maybe not. I'm assuming  
that this is the first time Harry has been to a funeral that meant 
something to him (he is old enough and loved the person). 
Sorry, not really a great response to your question- I'm very 
tangential today!

> 9.	Did the funeral go as planned? Some, at least, of the 
> onlookers were genuinely shocked when Dumbledore's body 
combusted. 
> And another thing, did it ignite all by itself, or did somebody set 
> fire to it? 

I think this was Dumbledore's plan for himself, and that most 
there did not know it would happen. It seems that Hagrid did, as 
he was in change of the placement of the body, but perhaps that 
is it. 

Sidebar 2: I have wondered recently if Dumbledore's tomb may 
not be the oft-discussed "graveyard" at Hogwart's, and all our 
speculation about what might happen there and who is buried 
there might not have been already sunk. End Sidebar 2.

> 10.	This has been discussed a lot, but must be asked again 
here. 
> What about that white smoke taking the shape of a phoenix? 
Was it 
> Fawkes? Was it the essence of Dumbledore, for want of a 
better word? 
> Or something (-one) else? 

I'm of two minds and will be happy with either choice for the 
white phoenix- either the Spirit of Dumbledore or a Patronus. 

> 11.	In a way the White Tomb is the true "magic brethren" 
> monument. Virtually everyone came to pay their respects to 
> Dumbledore, the entire Ministry, the denizen of Hogsmead and 
Diagon 
> Alley, the representatives from the WW abroad, the centaurs, 
the 
> merpeople, even the Castle ghosts. Yet there were few 
conspicuous 
> absences. Goblins did not come, and no mention has been 
made about 
> house-elves. Do you think that is significant? 

House Elf liberation just has to be involved in DH in some way, 
and this was a subtle reminder that they are not included still. 
Not even Dobby! Very surprising. 

> 14.	There is something odd about the way Ginny accepts 
Harry's 
> decision, while Ron and Hermione refuse to do so. Even 
stranger, 
> Harry does not really attempt to talk them out of sharing his 
> destiny. (And still more strange seems his surprise at Ron and 
> Hermione's reaction.) Does it mean that for Harry (and even for 
> Rowling) friendship is something infinitely more important than 
love? 
> Even so, Ginny is not just a girlfriend; she is a friend as well. 

Maybe it is poor writing, or maybe it is very intentional 
characterization, but the relationship between Ginny and Harry 
just never felt very deep to me. He is attracted to her and vice 
versa, they have a great "fling", enjoy their time together, and like 
each other, but the real LOVE in the story is still the love between 
the trio; they still have the deep bond that has been forged 
through time and experience. Ginny, present in all of their 
lives, is a lovely addition to Harry's life, but the essential parts 
that make him whole are still only Ron and Hermione. He does 
not *need* Ginny as he needs Ron and Hermione. In other 
words, I DO think JKR believes that LOVE is the strongest bond, 
and the responses of Ginny, Ron, and Hermione at the end 
show that the True Love between the trio of friends is, at this 
point, stronger than the romantic "love" (or "strong like") that 
Harry and Ginny feel.

Thanks for a great conclusion to the chapter discussions!

Celia
who has a prominent nose, and was just thinking today how sad 
she will be if the character with a big hooked nose turns out to be 
totally evil.