Family and Other Loyalty

[elfundeb]

No: HPFGUIDX 177679

Catlady:
> The real issue of discussion is, at what point does loyalty to
> family get trumped?
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
I think this can be an interesting discussion. It's not one that the
series ever entertains though, IMO. Which is too bad and I think an
example of us fans deepening what was, in the end, a rather simple
tale.

JKR could have used Marietta's story (or Sirius's or Regulus's or
Draco's or Percy's) to explore family loyalty and when (if ever) it
should be broken and are there right ways or wrong ways, etc., etc.
She didn't. Instead it came down to a personal cult allied to
Dumbledore (and then Harry) that was the deciding factor. Were you
breaking to stand with Dumbledore? Then it's good. If you were
breaking to stand against Dumbledore, then it's bad.

Debbie:
I've thought long and hard about JKR's apparent insistence on loyalty to
Dumbledore.  Taken at face value, it's one of the creepier things about him,
one which has given me pause ever since he commented in CoS that "you must
have shown me real loyalty down in the Chamber.  Nothing but that could have
called Fawkes to you."  Frankly, that sort of thing does seem at first blush
to imply a cult of personality.

But perhaps a better way to look at it is to ask why Dumbledore inspires
that kind of loyalty.  The truth is that Dumbledore is too distant and keeps
too many secrets to draw allegiance by force of personality; Harry's visits
to Dumbledore's office are extremely rare and are always precipitated by an
external event.  What draws people to Dumbledore's leadership is the cause
he represents and his record of success against Grindelwald.  He is an
extremely powerful wizard, but uses his power and cleverness against Dark
Wizards.  Even Voldemort was afraid of Dumbledore.  Harry is well aware of
this, and has been since PS/SS.

Moreover, defeating Voldemort has been Harry's number one goal since at
least that book.  ("If Snape gets hold of the Stone, Voldemort's coming
back!  Haven't you heard what it was like when he was trying to take over?
There won't be any Hogwarts to get expelled from!  He'll flatten it, or turn
it into a school for Dark Arts!  . . . If I get caught before I can get to
the Stone, well, I'll have to go back to the Dursleys and wait for Voldemort
to find me there, because I'm never going over to the Dark Side!  I'm going
through that trapdoor tonight and nothing you two say is going to stop me!
Voldemort killed my parents, remember?")

Harry's primary choice in PS/SS is not to follow Dumbledore (he thought
going after the Stone might get him expelled), but to oppose Voldemort.  His
continued allegiance to Dumbledore after he learns the truth about him in DH
makes much more sense when considered in light of Harry's goal.  Harry tells
Aberforth, "Sometimes you've *got* to think about the greater good!  This is
war!" and "I'm of age, and I'm going to keep fighting even if you've given
up!"  Harry knew all along that fighting Voldemort could put him in, as
Aberforth says, "in a worse state than if he'd left 'em well alone."  Harry
continues to follow Dumbledore's instructions because he knows that
Dumbledore's mission was the same as his own:  Defeat Voldemort.

As for Marietta, I find fault with Hermione's jinx, and JKR's apparent
approval of a permanent SNEAK scar, but Hermione did clearly state the goal
of the DA in the Hogs Head.  ("Of course I do [want to pass the DADA O.W.L.]
But more than that, I want to be properly trained in defence because . . .
because . . . [deep breath] . . . because Lord Voldemort is back.")  The
goal of the DA was to defend themselves against *Voldemort.*  And she laid
out the Ministry's views.  ("We think the reason Umbridge doesn't want us
trained in Defence Against the Dark Arts," said Hermione, "is that she's got
some . . . some mad idea that Dumbledore could use the students in the
school as a private army.  She thinks he'd mobilise us against the
Ministry.")  And Marietta signed.  In that moment, she chose fighting
Voldemort vs. supporting the Ministry.

And lastly, I don't think Dumbledore's Army, despite its name, was ever a
Dumbledore cult.  It always revolved around Harry, who was the attraction
that drew people to the first meeting, and who was formally elected
leader at the first official meeting in the RoR.  The name was a useful
cover for Harry's Defence Association, which played on the Ministry's
fears.  While the name conveniently permitted Dumbledore to take the blame
for it, the D.A. was always Harry's.  Neville uses the DA as a rallying cry
in DH, but his actions reflect the lessons that he learned from *Harry* and
his loyalty is to Harry, whom he considers the true leader of the
resistance.

Debbie
suspecting that JKR believes the Blacks illustrate the complexities of
family loyalty


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