Villain!Dumbledore (was: re:HatingDH/Dementors/...Draco/.../KeepSlytherin House)

[montavilla47]

No: HPFGUIDX 177697

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "sistermagpie" <sistermagpie at ...> wrote:
>
> > Prep0strus:
> > I'm confused as to why so many people HATE Dumbledore at this 
> point,
> > especially Slytherin lovers. We learned a lot about him, and he is 
> not
> > perfect, by any means. But he is, by and large, good.  It sounds 
> like
> > many of his failings are failings we see in Slytherins - ambition,
> > arrogance, secrecy, the willingness to use people for his own 
> means. 
> > But, his means are for GOOD.  
> 
Montavilla47:

I don't think of arrogance as a Slytherin trait so much as a 
Gryffindor  trait.  I may be somewhat subversive in thinking 
that way.  Ambition and secrecy, yes, I associate those with 
Slytherin.  

And yes, Dumbledore's aims are good.  Who could argue 
(reasonably) against tolerance and inclusion?  Who wouldn't 
support the idea  of helping werewolves assimilate into society?  
Sending embassies to giants and so forth.  Who but the basest
bigot would balk at treating Muggleborns with respect?

What bugs me about Dumbledore is, I suppose, his utter lack of
humility and that he does talk as though he's taking 
responsibility when he really isn't.

It's cute in PS/SS when he talks about how clever his trap with 
the mirror was.  And it's very satisfying at the end with the 
dramatic changing of the colors to represent Gryffindor's victory.

Until you look at it from the other side and realize he had days
to award those points and that waiting until the last moment was
pure showmanship that humiliated the Slytherins and made a 
hash of the hard work the other students in all the other Houses
did to carefully accumulate their points.

I bought that Dumbledore had his reasons for alienating himself
from Harry in OotP, but it made me very uncomfortable that he
made Snape teach Harry Occlumency.  Not because I think Snape
was using it as an excuse to torment Harry--although if that was
an issue, it should have addressed.  But because I didn't see how
it wasn't putting Snape into an impossible situation.  Dumbledore
knew that Voldemort could look out through Harry's eyes.  He'd
seen it.  How was Snape supposed to maintain his cover in that
situation?  

Then, while Dumbledore tells Harry that the fault was his--he
throws in little things like, "It's my fault because I should have 
realized Snape was too screwed up to deal with you.  But it's 
okay, because you're so filled with love that it wasn't even a 
problem."

So... Dumbledore risked his most valuable spy to teach Harry
a skill that Harry didn't need to begin with.

Then at the end, he throws in the bit about Harry not 
getting a prefect badge.  Does it really matter at this point?
Who cares?  But apparently Dumbledore felt the need to 
make sure Harry knew that he was just that much better than
Ron Weasley that he would have gotten the badge if he
wasn't needed for saving the world instead.

When Dumbledore really started grating on my nerves was 
in HBP.  It starts with Dumbledore lecturing the Dursleys
on their poor parenting skills while knocking them in the
heads with glasses of mead.  Okay, tip number one in 
making friends and influencing people:  If you want 
someone to listen to what you are saying, try not to 
distract them by knocking them about the head at the
same time.  

Also, when you ask someone to take in a baby and 
assume the financial responsibility for raising it, 
try to provide some friggin' support or else refrain
from showing up fifteen years later to scold them 
for how badly they handled the child you abandonned.

Also, the Dursley don't respond well to insults or 
threats.  They do, however, respond to flattery,
sincere or not.  You're good at flattery, Dumbledore.
You use it with Harry all the time.  

Then there's that bizarre remark about Merope
not having Lily's courage.  Okay.  Again, what's
the point of that comparison?  It's like the 
prefect line.  Don't be too hard on her, Harry.
She wasn't Lily.  Instead of:  Don't be too 
hard on her, Harry.  She was STARVING and
it was the dead of winter and she was dressed in
rags and she still managed to do something 
way harder than you will ever do in your life.

Oh, and yeah, pregnant women with no education,
skills, looks, money, or self-esteem can't really take 
care of themselves that well.

On the other hand, while I don't necessarily agree 
with allowing the needs of Remus Lupin to 
outweigh the loss of Davy's eye, or Draco Malfoy
to supercede Kate Bell or Ron Weasley, it really
warmed my heart to see Dumbledore reach out
to save Draco.  Because it seemed that if 
Dumbledore cared enough to save Draco, then
he truly must care for all his students--not just
the remarkable Mr. Potter.

That was mitigated in DH, when Dumbledore 
says he prefers that Draco not tear his soul on 
"my" death.  As if it would okay with Dumbledore
if Draco tears it on someone else's.  But I might be
too picky there. 

I actually like the Grindelwald stuff, even if Arianna
and Kendra never really came alive to me as 
characters.  It made sense to me that Dumbledore 
would have made mistakes in his past and surely
he would have developed some humility because of 
that?  

I wouldn't have minded Dumbledore being 
manipulative in DH, if his plans didn't seem so
dumb.  Like, gathering all the books on Horcuxes
and not assigning Harry to read them during HBP.

Hermione accio'ing the books from the office after
his death wasn't something he planned.  It was an
accident.  But if she hadn't done that, they wouldn't
have had the first clue about how to destroy the
Horcruxes they didn't know how to find.

I could forgive him setting Snape up for murder,
except... he also charged Snape with telling Harry
about the sacrifice.  How was Snape supposed 
to do that after being killed for the Elder Wand?

I dislike that Dumbledore's reaction to Snape's
return to the "good side" was "You disgust me!"
But what the heck.  Maybe that was the best
way to handle Snape at that point.

I really dislike Dumbledore's implication that
Snape was sorted too soon.  That implies that
Snape was maybe a little too good for the
house he was Head of!  That's sort of like
saying to the star of an WNBA team, "Wow.
You're good.  Maybe you could have even 
played on a *boy's* team."

Or as Pippin says, "Mighty white of you,
Severus."

Condescending.  Arrogant.  No wonder
Snape looks stricken.  lllllllllll

Montavilla47