Likeable Slughorn (was: Villain!Dumbledore )

[Zara]

No: HPFGUIDX 177869

> Montavilla47:
> But JKR is *so* careful to show the downside.  Are those of you
> who like Slughorn really okay with the way he treats Ron?  Are 
> you comfortable with Hermione trotting off to the Slug Club
> while Ron is excluded?  Do you not see how that's teaching her
> that Ron is essentially not worth her... not worth *her*?

zgirnius:
I don't like Slughorn, actually. I don't like old boy networks, and 
prefer to try and get by on what talent I have instead, because that 
is more comfortable for me personally. Some movers and shakers I have 
met bore me (and I them); I prefer to socialize with my fellow nerds, 
even if they offer me fewer opportunities for advancement. But I do 
think Sluggie is a 'good Slytherin'. 

I agree with Mike - Sluggie does not have an obligation to further 
everyone's success to the same degree during his free time, so I do 
not have a problem with the way he treats Ron. I don't think he is a 
particularly good teacher, but at a school that includes Hagrid, 
Trelawney, and Binns among the staff, I would not point to him as a 
particular problem, and he adds a 'fun' dimension other teachers lack 
that may well bring something new to the table in terms of teaching 
and learning styles. 

I am totally comfortable with Hermione trotting off to the club, it 
is Ron I have the problem with. If Hermione goes on to be a much 
greater "success" in life than Ron, and he can't deal with that, they 
are better off breaking up right then and there over the Slug Club. 
He should find someone small and weak enough for his fragile ego to 
handle, and Hermione should live as though the sky is the limit. 
\climbs off feminist soapbox 

(Aside: I think Ron CAN handle it, he's had a lot of practise being 
Harry's best friend and the youngest of the variously accomplished 
and outstanding male Weasleys. I think Hermione needs to let Ron know 
that she loves and admires him for traits other than worldly success. 
We see some indication of both in DH).

My personal hotbuttons aside, Hermione wanted to include Ron and was 
planning to invite him to the Christmas party. She did not change her 
mind because of Sluggie, but because Ron hurt her feelings. She then 
went with McLaggen not because of his connections, but because she 
calculated that would annoy Ron the most. I think this was precisely 
because it does not matter to her, she did not pick Ron because he 
was the Quidditch Keeper, or a Pureblood, or something, but because 
she loves him. 

> Montavilla:
> I don't think it was the ideology that turned Slughorn
> off the Death Eaters.  It may have been partly the 
> violence.  But I think the main reason he's anti-
> Death Eater is because they *lost.*

zgirnius:
I don't think we really have a basis to decide what he would have 
done in the first war if Voldemort had not vaporized himself and had 
won. However, in the second war, Voldemort was indeed 'greater and 
more terrible' than before. He had taken over the government and his 
puppets were running things. And everyone seemed to believe that he 
would win the Battle of Hogwarts. Yet Sluggie joined the opposite 
side in that fight, in spite of his own doubts whether that 
was 'wise'.