Defining the Other and peeking into Forests (was:Re: A sandwich)

[horridporrid03]

No: HPFGUIDX 178733

> >>Lizzyben:
> > <snip>
> > In this crazy world, the worst stereotypes about "the Other" are 
> > actually true.
> > <snip>

> >>Prep0strus:
> <snip>
> When you say the stereotypes about 'the Other' are true, it
> for me negates the idea of them being a true 'other'.

Betsy Hp:
Hmm... Okay I've been thinking [flee! flee for your lives!!] and I 
might be twisting what both you and Lizzyben are meaning when you 
say "Other".  But if you take the "Other" as the shadow self or 
character or group in a story, than I don't think we the reader can 
just arbitrarily pick who the representation is going to be.  
Instead, the text will make it clear.  And IMO, JKR clearly gives 
Slytherin house that role.  [seriously run! she's bringing up 
slytherin!!!]

I think that gets established quite early on in PS/SS.  The second 
wizard Harry ever meets (Draco) is destined for Slytherin (the first, 
Hagrid, is of course a Gryffindor).  Harry's worst fear at that point 
is being put in Slytherin.  And then, just to drive that point home, 
he has a dream (that he for some reason forgets) featuring the three 
main Slytherin characters (Draco, Snape, Voldemort).

What got me thinking in the first place was Pippin mentioning fairy 
stories and I said that JKR avoided the deep dark forest far too 
carefully for me to agree that this series fits the bill.  My opinion 
still is that she does avoid the forest as much as possible, but as I 
thought about it I realized that Harry does tiptoe into the forest a 
few times.  And in just about every case, a Slytherin is involved.  

His first foray was with Draco by his side (when he witnesses the 
Voldemort controlled Quirrell drinking the Unicorn's blood in 
PS/SS).   And his last one was following Snape's sending (when he 
dove into frigid waters to retrieve the Gryffindor sword).

So I'd say it's pretty clear that the role of "Other" is firmly taken 
by the Slytherins.  What's really interesting, IMO [for the love of 
God, hide the children!], is that it also seems that Slytherin 
represents womanhood.  I'm um, going to be mentioning genitalia -- 
just to give you a heads up. [...!?!]

IIRC, forests in fairy stories tend to represent sexual awakening or 
puberty, right?  I find it interesting that the first activity Harry 
witnesses in the forest is a blood letting done by a Slytherin and 
accompanied by a Slytherin.  And he's rescued by a stand in for 
masculinity, a Centaur.  I think this could be seen as Harry's first 
exposure to sex.  It's deviant of course, since Voldemort's 
involved.  And since the other player is a Unicorn, I think we're 
looking at a rape of innocence.  (No wonder both boys are terrified.)

At this point I think you could argue that rather than being 
specifically female, Slytherin in this scene is representing 
(deviant) human sexuality in toto.  I lean towards it being female 
myself (recognizing I'm on shaky ground) because it's a mouth that 
gets bloody.  So... yeah, basically I'm saying Harry and Draco get 
scared by a sexually mature vagina and Harry is rescued by a penis.  
(How's *that* for overanalyzing? <bg>)

But that last image of Harry in the forest in DH is pretty open-shut, 
I think.  Harry dives into deep water to pull out (rescue) a large 
sword.  We know the whole thing's been set up by a Slytherin (Snape) 
as a test of Harry's Gryffindor-ship.  That the water is so cold it 
could kill Harry, that he's also strangled by another Slytherin 
artifact (the locket), saved by a fellow (male) Gryffindor, and 
manages to save the sword is telling, IMO.

In this case, Harry faces down the killer vagina and rescues the 
penis.  The coldness, the strangulation: this is not a friendly look 
at the female at all, IMO.  And I think that fits with how JKR 
treated the "water" house in the end.

In Western mythology water is associated with the female.  It 
represents both birth (birth waters) and death (the liquifaction of a 
decomposing corpse), and in Western society both birth and death have 
been traditionally overseen by women.  (It's changed a bit now, but 
our story-telling tropes and myths are still affected by long ago 
traditions.)

JKR tied Slytherin quite firmly to the female.  Just as she tied 
Gryffindor quite firmly to the male.  Because her hero was a 
Gryffindor, his "other" had to be (and through the text clearly was, 
IMO), Slytherin.  But instead of embracing his other, instead of 
facing his fears of the other, Harry walked away.  Fought his way 
free the way the story goes, honestly.

So hmm... maybe the Potterseries *is* a fairy story?  But if so, than 
it's a failed one where the hero refuses to face up to his sexual 
fears; kills, ignores and does whatever necessary to fully sublimate 
his sexual counterpart; and ends up happily stuck in childhood dreams 
of a game of "house".  It's a story about a boy who never grows up.  
Huh.  I guess in the end, Harry never found his Wendybird (or maybe 
he just succeeded in killing her?).

Betsy Hp (posting this from work ::looks around shiftily:: -- pretty 
sure this post will get her branded seriously wacko ::looks around 
shiftily:: -- and wondering how the hell's she's going to rename this 
thread...)
[i *warned* you!]