Dark Book

[Carol]

No: HPFGUIDX 176985

lizzyben wrote:

> Well, the weirdness is that it works both ways. Yes, on the surface
it is about the dehumanization of Muggle-borns, but the subtext is
about dehumanization of Slytherins (and contrasting glorification of
Gryffindor). 
<snip>
> I don't know how it happened, I'm almost positive it wasn't
intentional on JKR's part - but it happened. Maybe that's just human
nature, that even when trying to express how awful bigotry is, we
can't help but blame "the other" for it.
<snip>
> Surface/subtext
> 
> - Choices are what matter/predestination removes choices

Carol responds:
So Snape's choice to protect Harry and help him to defeat Voldemort
means nothing? Wormtail's choice to betray his friends means nothing?
Harry's choice to sacrifice himself rather than fight Voldemort means
nothing? I disagree on all counts.

Lizzyben:
> - World not divided between good & DE/world totally divided between
good & evil, us & them
> - Good is something you do/ good is something you *are*, & good
people can do bad things if they want to.

Carol responds:
*Or* good people are not perfect and make mistakes. Ron, for example,
walks out on his friends before returning to them. Anger very nearly
gets the better of him. Harry wants revenge against Snape and expects
to kill Voldemort for most of the book and only changes his mind on
both counts after seeing Snape's memories. (Note that he uses the
Cruciatus Curse on Carrow *before* he has that epiphany.) Harry also
chooses the Horcruxes over the Hallows, a crucial decision that
probably saves him and the WW. He chooses to publicly vindicate Snape.
Snape, the epitome of "them" (Slytherins and, ostensibly, Death
Eaters) turns out to be an ally without whom Harry could not have
defeated Voldemort. Even the Malfoys are capable of love, and Regulus
Black, the Slytherin brother, turns out to be nobler, at least with
regard to house-elves, than his Gryffindor brother and at least
equally couragerous. The worst traitor in the books is Peter
Pettigrew, a Gryffindor. Dumbledore could have gone the way of Gellert
Grindelwald but chose to renounce power and the desire to control
Muggles (three of whom abused his sister and were indirectly
responsible for all the tragedies that followed) through magic.
Forgive me, but I think you're seeing what you want to see and
ignoring any evidence to the contrary.

Lizzyben:
> - "Blood status" doesn't matter/ blood is all that matters - bad
Slytherin blood will out, pure Gryffindor blood will save.

Carol:
There's no such thing as "pure Gryffindor blood." Hermione and Lily
are Muggleborns sorted into Gryffindor. It's Harry's and Lily's
self-sacrifice, two acts of love on different scales, that have the
power of ancient magic.

Again, you're ignoring Snape and Regulus, Slytherins who choose good
over evil, risking or losing their lives to fight against Voldemort.
You're also ignoring Slughorn, who ends up fighting the DEs, and
Andromeda, who chose to marry a Muggleborn and lost the love of her
sisters by so doing. You're also ignoring the students and staff
members from the other Houses who joined the battle against Voldemort
and the DEs.

I agree that the message that blood doesn't matter is rather garbled.
Hagrid thinks that the Malfoys have "bad blood" and he actually says
that blood is important with regard to his half-brother, Grawp, but I
don't think we're supposed to take Hagrid as our spokesman. And the
power of Harry's blood in Voldemort has nothing to do with him or with
Gryffindor. It has to do with the power of love via Lily's
self-sacrifice, the same power that protects Harry from Voldemort as
long as he's with Petunia, no Gryffindor and not even a witch. Her
blood has power because it's Lily's blood, which has the power of
love. (I do think that "blood" either is or isn't magical, and unicorn
blood and dragon's blood have magical properties, but that's
altogether different from "Gryffindor blood" or "Slytherin blood,"
concepts that have no place in the books.

Lizzyben:
> - Bigotry is bad/ bigotry against Slytherins is totally justified.

Carol:
But it isn't, as Harry learns. McGonagall is *wrong* in her judgment
of Snape and Slughorn and Slytherin in general, as the reader learns
through "The Prince's Tale. Again, Harry publicly vindicates Snape, he
names his second son after two headmasters, one of them a Slytherin
(Snape), and he and Draco become, if not friends, at least not
enemies. He considers Draco's life worth saving. A Slytherin, Regulus
Black, becomes the rallying cry for the house-elves, and Phineas
Nigellus says, "Let it not be forgotten that Slytherin played its
part" (quoted from memory). 

I don't like the way that McGonagall judges the whole House by one
students' action or the way that she assumes that any of the older
Slytherins who choose to fight will fight for Voldemort, either. But
she thinks that Snape is a murderer and Slughorn a self-preserving
coward.  We don't see her changing her view, but she is present for
Harry's vindication of Snape and for Slughorn's participation in the
battle. Like Harry for nearly seven books, and like Lupin who
advocates killing when Harry is advocating more peaceful means
(Expelliarmus), like Hagrid, who wrongly informs Harry that all the
DEs are from Slytherin, she is judging a whole group by a few. But we,
the readers, can see that she is wrong. Not a single Slytherin student
fights for Voldemort (Voldie is lying to Lucius), and Draco stops
Crabbe from killing or Crucioing Harry.

The point is, most of the characters, including Harry until his
epiphany, judge by appearances. Sometimes, it's Harry who's judged
that way. He speaks Parseltongue: therefore, he must be the Heir of
Slytherin and responsible for Petrifying students. He has screaming
fits during which he's rolling on the ground; therefore, he must be
either unstable or an attention seeker. He brought back Cedric
Diggory's body; therefore, he must be somehow responsible for Cedric's
death. We, seeing from Harry's pov, know that the other characters are
wrong, but we also see the evidence on which their judgments are based
(or the absence of evidence, in the case of the many people who doubt
Harry's and DD's not-very-convincing testimony that Voldemort is back).

Sometimes, the character judged by appearances is someone else:
Hagrid, supposedly responsible for releasing Slytherin's monster,
first expelled and then, fifty years later, arrested on suspicion of
repeating the performance. Sirius Black is regarded by the entire WW
as a murderer and a traitor (and his own conduct in PoA lends credence
to that belief). Snape, ironically, is viewed in exactly the same way,
as a murderer and a traitor, from the last chapters of HBP through
"The Prince's Tale" (when Harry and the reader learn the truth) and
"The Flaw in the Plan" (when McGonagall and Flitwick and many others
learn it). Even Dumbledore is subjected, post mortem, to contrasting
accounts of his life and character, and Harry learns that the truth
lies somewhere between and that Dumbledore, too, is human and needs to
be forgiven.

We simply cannot look at Slytherin or Snape or Dumbledore or even
Harry as they're presented throughout the books by a narrator seeing
from Harry's point of view and expect a clear, objective, and accurate
assessment. We have to wait until all the facts are in: "The Prince's
Tale" for Snape, "King's Cross" for Dumbledore, and the epilogue for
Harry (who names his second son Albus Severus) and Slytherin (which is
still a rival House but an okay place to be). We can hope for a
friendship between Albus Severus Potter and Scorpius Malfoy, in marked
contrast to the enmity between James Potter and Severus Snape or Harry
Potter and Draco Malfoy.

We can't judge Slytherin by McGonagall's words and actions. *She* is
judging the whole by a part, all the students by Pansy Parkinson (who,
in turn, is operating on incomplete information--Harry Potter used a
deadly curse on her boyfriend the previous year; that boyfriend and
their long-time HoH and (till that day) headmaster are, she thinks,
loyal DEs; the school can be saved by turning Harry over to Voldemort.
Her view is not so far removed from Aberforth Dumbledore's idea that
the "good" side should hold a few Slytherins hostage). Both Pansy and
McGonagall are wrong, as the Hufflepuffs were wrong to think that
Harry was the Heir of Slytherin and the WW was wrong to think that
Sirius Black betrayed the Potters to their deaths and murdered twelve
Muggles. 

JKR has been withholding information until the last book. Only when
all the facts are in can Harry understand that Slytherin does not
equal Death Eater and even Death Eaters can be redeemed. And once
Harry understands, the narrator ceases to be unreliable. No more
comments about Snape as the man Harry hated. No more assertions that
Dumbledore betrayed Harry. Instead we get Harry telling Ron and
hermione the truth about both of them (admittedly, offpage) and naming
his second son for two flawed but brilliant headmasters--and it's the
Slytherin who's praised for his courage.

Lizzyben:
> - Violence & bullying are bad/ unless we're doing it.

Carol:
We are not supposed to admire James and Sirius, the Gryffindor
bullies. "The Prince's Tale" restates Harry's discomfort knowing that
his father and godfather were indeed arrogant, bullying "toerags." And
I think we're supposed to see that the Gryffindors' treatment of
Slytherins (and the Twins' treatment of Dudley) is no better than
Draco's treatment of Harry in HBP or the Muggle levitating at the QWC.
Harry's Crucio on Carrow puts him on the same level, briefly, as
Bellatrix Lestrange. But once he sees Snape's memories, he changes
tactics. He ceases to seek revenge and instead, sacrifices himself as
an act of love. I doubt very much that he condones bullying on the
part of his children (teasing is another matter and an inevitable part
of childhood).

Lizzyben:
> - Women are equals/ women are worthless <snip>

Carol:
Women are worthless? It's Lily's sacrifice that saves Harry. Hermione
saves Harry from Bathilda!Nagini and from the DEs who arrive at Xeno
lovegood's house. her protective magic keeps HRH alive. Bellatrix is
Voldemort's "last, best lieutenant," a powerful force on the bad side.
Narcissa's love for Draco enables Harry to fake his own death and
confront Voldemort a second time. As for Ginny, it's her age that
temporarily keeps her from fighting, and in the end, she's saved from
Bellatrix by her mother--women in all cases. Harry's view of Hermione
is sufficient in itself to counter this point.

Carol, who can't possibly answer every point in this list but
disagrees with most of them for the reasons given