Dark Book - Blood and Cruelty/ Draco

[starview316]

No: HPFGUIDX 177242



> > Amy:
> > Well, I agree that Draco is definitely not in the superior 
position
> > during his confrontations with Harry. But taking on the Man? 
Really?
> > <snip>
> 
> Betsy Hp:
> Goodness yes!  Cheered at his Sorting, youngest ever Seeker, "the 
> hero who conquered the Dark Lord," chased by older girls for his 
> first ever school dance, stalked by younger girls when he's an 
> upperclassman, close to the elusive headmaster, beloved darling of 
> most of the staff...  How is Harry *not* a BMOC?


Amy:

I think you may be assuming that the average Hogwarts resident thinks 
about Harry Potter a lot more often than they really do. Every new 
student was cheered at their Sorting, Harry was asked by a total of 
two girls to go to the Ball (one younger and one older, and actually, 
this is the exact number of people who asked Hermione to the dance, 
too), and I think this is the first time I've ever heard Harry called 
the "darling" of most of the staff...most of the staff that he hardly 
knows exist, I might point out. Where in canon are we supposed to get 
the indication that any teacher other than Dumbledore, McGonagall, 
Hagrid, and possibly Trelawney, have every given him more than a 
passing thought (when he's not drawing attention to himself?)?


> > >>Amy:
> > Throughout the HP books, Harry's average hangout group consists 
of  
> > Ron and Hermione ( and Fred and George on frequent enough 
occasion 
> > to be mentioned).
 
> Betsy Hp:
> Exclusive inner circle.  This doesn't make a good case for average, 
> overlooked Harry, I'm afraid. <g>

Amy:

Yes, but I wasn't trying to make a case for average, overlooked 
Harry. I think there's a difference between people knowing of you 
(and possibly not thinking badly of you), and liking you well enough 
to call yourself popular. To have an exclusive inner circle, you have 
to have enough people actually *wanting* to be part of that circle to 
make it "exclusive". If Harry's celebrity status had counted the way 
you seem to think it does (basically, if "the hero who conquered the 
Dark Lord" counted for anything), there'd be cases of people falling 
all over themselves to try and be friends with Harry. There aren't. 
Though I agree that this divide was crossed in HBP, but then again, 
this was the book in which Draco wasn't taking on Harry. 


> > >>Amy:
> > It's been mentioned on this list before that Harry barely knows 
the 
> > names of the students in his year, let alone in the rest of 
the    
> > school.
> 
> Betsy Hp:
> He doesn't need to.  They know *him*.
>

Amy:

They know *of* him. And again, I really think you're assuming the 
average student thinks about Harry Potter a lot more than they 
usually do. I can know of the girl sitting two desks down from me, I 
could say I like her well enough even though I rarely talk to her, or 
think about her outside of class. Every other student in the class 
could do the same, that doesn't mean they'd like her well enough to 
choose her as Prom Queen, or whatever. 

> > >>Amy:
> > *Hermione* is able to convince a group of students to join 
a       
> > Defence group led by him in order to pass their DADA OWLs.
> 
> Betsy Hp:
> By evoking Harry's name.  As became clear at their very first 
> meeting, which pissed Harry off, but was still the case.

My point was that there was maybe 30 students, tops, in that group, 
and the majority of them were there to pass their OWL/NEWT exams; not 
because Harry or his name had any particular pull beyond his 
supposedly extensive knowledge of DADA hexes (and of course, because 
they wanted to find out whether or not he was actually crazy, since 
he's just that popular!). I thought it was obvious from the lack of 
interest in the D.A. in HBP, that few people were there out of any 
reason beyond passing their OWLS/NEWTs. Note that I'm still not 
saying that Harry is overlooked, I just think that the students of 
Hogwarts really don't think about him that often.

 
> > >>Amy:
> > Could he convince half the school body to join in a smear 
campaign 
> > against one student? I don't know, I have yet to see evidence of 
it.
> > <snip>
> 
> Betsy Hp:
> Harry did one better.  His popularity lead to large group of 
students 
> *literally* smearing three other students.  (The OotP train stomp.)

Amy:

I'm sorry, maybe it's a difference of opinions, but I can't count a 
group of six students as a "large" one that somehow surpasses the 
combined Households of Slytherin and Hufflepuff, regardless of what 
they were doing.

>Betsy Hp
> So yeah, I'm still rather convinced that when it comes down to 
> student popularity, Harry has it over Draco.

Amy:

I'm not sure whether or not I agree, because the student population 
of Hogwarts (just like the population of the Wizarding World, I might 
point out), is unusually fickle -- they don't tend to stick to one 
side, if you get what I mean. There are definitely times when the 
student body cheers Harry over Draco (some Quidditch games, when they 
win the House Cup -- then again, I don't know if this is Harry vs. 
Draco so much as Gryffindor vs. Slytherin). And they did all laugh 
when Ferret!Draco was bounced by Moody. But I should also point out 
that we've actually seen large groups of students laughing at Harry 
due to something Draco's done, far more often than we've seen the 
reverse, regardless of who these students actually are, or how much 
physical violence was involved.