Suspension of disbelief - Being dependent

[pippin_999]

No: HPFGUIDX 182474


> 
> Betsy Hp:
> Right.  Actually, my thinking is that Voldemort should have been 
> beaten before Harry was born.  Or before he was even a twinkle, for 
> that matter.  
> 
> What it comes down to, for me, is that when we finally see Voldemort 
> in all his terrifying glory... he just ain't all that.  Looking at 
> his antics during DH, looking at the people he surrounded himself 
> with, looking at how he *treated* those he surrounded himself with, 
> it makes no sense to me that Voldemort was able to terrorize the WW 
> so completely.  

Pippin:
I agree, Voldemort should have been stopped when he was a real baby,
not a stunted imitation of one. But that would have taken a world that
pays far more attention to the fate of its children than the WW -- or
ours.

But the people around Voldemort aren't seeing him as we do. They don't
have a V-chip in their heads; they can't tell what he's thinking, they
can't see the pathetic little babymind he really is. But he can see
into their heads, oh yes, every treasonous thought, and he doesn't
have to be looking into their eyes to do it. There's no sneaking up on
him, nobody knows what spell could kill him, and hardly anyone gets a
chance at a second shot.  To most of the WW, Voldemort remains  remote
and terrifying.  As for his servants, if they're not sincerely
terrified, they're  dead.


The WW also didn't have a lot of civil rights in the first place.
There's no free press, no right to counsel,  due process is more
honored in the breach than the observance, and croneyism is the rule
rather than  the exception, as is discrimination against minorities.
They've  always kept wands out of the hands of House elves and
goblins, why not Muggleborns too? The leaders who would protest such a
change have largely been silenced by the time  the ministry falls.   

We keep invoking grass roots resistance movements as if everyone
should know such things are possible. But do they? The only revolts
the Trio learn about in school are goblin rebellions that failed.
AFAWK, the WW has no tradition of successful uprisings against the
Ministry or gallant resistance movements (the Order's work was secret)
or citizen militias. 

Hagrid is slapped down when he says he'd have gone after Black
himself.  Fudge speaks of Peter Pettigrew as a hero but a very foolish
man -- only "trained hit wizards" would have a chance against someone
like Black. And to give Fudge his due, we've seen the DE's defeat the
Order more than once. They were winning at the Ministry until
Dumbledore showed up, they outfought the Order and gained their
objective on the tower, and they'd have won the battle of Hogwarts if
it weren't for Harry.

The Ministry pamphlets speak of how to recognize DE's and inferi, but
not of practicing defensive spells, IRRC. DADA's been a joke for
years. The citizens of the WW may be armed, but they haven't been
taught to be dangerous.

In any case, it's perfectly legitimate for an author to be more
interested in  why people fail against tyranny than in how they succeed.

Betsy Hp: 
> And then once we finally *do* get to Harry, I don't see what Harry 
> did that no one else could do.  What was so *special* about this 
> kid.  <snip>Harry  wasn't particularly compassionate.  
<snip snip>
> Yes, I was talking about Harry having that horrible moment when you 
> realize your preconceived notions are wrong.  


Pippin:
Why should that be horrible? So, you're not the wise and wonderful
wizard everyone thinks. Pass the handkie.  You failed to predict the
consequences of your actions -- no O in divination for you! <vbg>

 Of course, if you were independent, then you'd have to blame yourself
if  your world wasn't as lovely as you'd like it to be. And Harry did
feel that way in OOP. He couldn't stand to blame himself or  the
people he loved for Sirius's death, so he chose to blame Snape instead.

But if everyone is deeply interdependent, then you never have to  feel
uniquely to blame--you can focus on trying to heal the world without
obsessing over who is at fault for it.

Pippin