ThatLetter/HoG/Portraits/Rookwood/Black/InLaws/Crabbe/ElWand/Stone/Sex/Lucius

[Catlady (Rita Prince Winston)]

No: HPFGUIDX 183967

Carol wrote in
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/183865>:

<< And the Ministry certainly didn't return his possessions after he
escaped from Azkaban; he was a wanted fugitive. It's *possible* that
they thoughtfully sent all his personal possessions (though the
Minisrty, with the exception of Bob Ogden, doesn't come across as
thoughtful, particularly in Barty Crouch's days), to his parents, >>

Despite Pippin's elegant
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/183885>
suggestion that Sirius packed up his own stuff and put it in storage
before going into hiding, I think it was Lupin, and not the Ministry,
who packed up everything from Sirius's home and sent it to his
parents' house. (That does not require my other belief, that despite
JKR Q&A, Lupin lived with Sirius rather than with James and Lily.)

<< would the parents who resented their rebel son have kept his
possessions (a personal letter, a photograph of the Potters, of all
people, and even his confiscated wand) in anticipation of the "little
swine's" return? It defies belief. >>

The mother didn't hate him as much as she said, or she was too
distraught to get around to unpacking the boxes that had been dumped
into Sirius's old bedroom (which she had not, in almost six years,
redecorated into a Sewing Room or Dark Magic Laboratory or whatever). 

The unpacking and putting away could be done by Sirius after he moved
back in. Maybe he and Lupin stood back to back and swooshed their
wands in a way that caused every object to rush back where it
belonged, that is, where it had belonged when Sirius had last seen
that room.

Carol wrote in
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/183867>:

<< I agree with the suggestion that Draco could have acquired [the
Hand of Glory] by owl order (not in reaction to his father's
treatment of him but out of practical necessity, as part of his scheme
for bringing the DEs into Hogwarts once he fixed the Vanishing Cabin
(long snip) He couldn't have brought it into Hogwarts himself because
the students in HBP were probed with Filch's secrecy sensor (Filch
confiscated a shrunken head from Crabbe or Goyle) and the owls were
being searched, just as they had been in OoP (presumably because DD
and Snape had some idea what Draco was up to). >>

This is a problem you created for yourself. If Draco bought the HoG
during the CoS school year or during the summer holiday between CoS
and PoA, then students and owls were not yet being searched when
entering Hogwarts.

Carol wrote in
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/183893>:

<< At any rate, it Filch's Dark detector didn't detect the Hand of
Glory, it failed in its purpose, which was to keep the students from
bringing dangerous or sinister objects into the school. If it detected
a shrunken head, more grisly than dangerouse AFAIK, it would surely
have detected a Hand of Glory. >>

Ah, an opportunity for more hand-waving! (and another unintended pun)
Wizarding logic being what it is, the Dark Detector, at least the one
used for searching trunks, had a grandfather clause: anything that
this student had previously possessed at Hogwarts would not be detected.

Mike Crudele wrote in
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/183894>:

<< I don't think there are wizard painters, at least you don't need
them to create an animated portrait. I think what you do need is a
magical picture frame and canvas. These are made by wizards that are a
cross between wandmakers and the manufacturers of the photograph
processing equipment that makes moving pictures/cards/etc. I like to
think that there is some potion making involved in imbuing the canvas
with the ability to host a bit of a deceased witch/wizard. (snip) I
think the Headmaster frames are magically created by the castle, in a
similar fashion as how the Room of Requirement works. Whenever a
headnaster or former headmaster dies and we need a new portrait, the
charm is activated. It's part of the magic of the castle. (snip) BTW,
this means that Snape's Headmaster portrait was created automatically.
But he had not finished with that whole crossing over process,
whatever his equivalent of Harry's Kings Cross was, so his portrait
was not yet animated when Harry had his final debriefing. Much as
Dumbledore's wasn't yet animated at the end of HBP. >>

Okay, we agree about the Headmaster portraits. 

I'm not ready to give up my idea that the Ministry building, St.
Mungo's, old family homes, and other wizarding institutions (including
a monastery, which could have avoided being confiscated by Henry VIII
by use of Muggle-repelling spells) generate the portraits by magic
same as Hogwarts does. Still your theory, that all the other paintings
have to have their frame and canvas prepared for the specific person
while that person is still alive, would explain why no portrait of
James and Lily Potter appeared in the ancient Potter family home, and
why the drunken monks got a group portrait instead of individual
portraits.

Carol wrote in
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/183895>:

<< an Unspeakable (as Rookwood possibly was, or else Rookwood was
higher up the bureaucratic ladder) or he'd have known that Bode
couldn't touch the Prophecy. >>

The Pensieve scene of Karkaroff's plea bargain: << "Augustus Rookwood
of the Department of Mysteries?" "I believe he used a network of
well-placed wizards, both inside the Ministry and out, to collect
information –" >>

Another Pensieve scene, the trial of Bagman, revealed that Bagman was
recruited as a spy for LV by Rookwood.

Old discussion on the list decided that Rookwood being the only name
provided by Karkaroff that was not already known to the Ministry could
be correlated with Sirius's statement that Karkaroff had put a lot of
people into Azkaban in his place, by assuming that interrogating
Rookwood led to arresting all of his spies and informants, including
Bagman.

I classed the idiot Bagman as a spy rather than an informant because
Bagman would not have known anything of interest to anyone (except
maybe Quidditch bettors) unless he acquired that information on
purpose. I figure the way such an idiot could be a spy is that even
important people would have wanted to invite him to their parties and
chat with him because of his celebrity, and they would have said too
much, in hope of impressing him, especially if he used the
conversational techniques recommended in guidebooks for teen girls,
like 'And what did you do then?'. He wouldn't have had to understand
what they told him in order to remember and repeat it.

Actually, before I checked for the quotes, I had the impression that
Rookwood was the Head of the Department of Mysteries, not just "of"
it. I want Rookwood to be an aristocratic old family because their
shield of arms is just so obvious: a big black bird sitting on a black
tower surrounded by trees.

Magpie wrote in
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/183920>:

<< Remember, Draco is a Black. He might have two maternal grandmothers
who are siblings and under the age of fourteen. It's a crazy family.>>

This is a forbidden "LOL" post.

By the way, I think the Black family arms should be, not what JKR drew
on her 'crazy' Black Family Tree, but a black serpent on a black
background.

Geoff wrote in
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/183933>:

<< Anyway, in the UK, the suffix "in-law" is only used in conjunction
with "sister' "brother', "son" or "daughter".  >>

No mother-in-law jokes?

Carole wrote in
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/183934>:

<< (He even mourns Crabbe, probably the only person to care about the
brutal fool.) >>

IIRC Crabbe had parents, including a father as stupid and brutal as he
was. Also, I always assumed that Crabbe, Goyle, and Bulstrode liked
each other, not just put up with each other because they each hung
around Draco.

Leeann wrote in
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/183935>:

<< One thing has bothered me about the Elder Wand. It is referred to
as "the Unbeatable Wand". If it is truly unbeatable, how did DD beat
Grindelwald? Is "Unbeatable" just a word used in folklore?, or is it
really undefeatable? >>

I really would like to read the story of that amazing duel. I believe
it was amazing and full of mighty spells despite what Skeeter implied,
and I believe that DD won by trickery (maybe even treachery?).

Pippin wrote in
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/183949>:

<< It was needed to explain Dumbledore's lie about what he would see
in the mirror of Erised, >>

I still suspect it was not a complete lie: he did see himself holding
a pair of woolly socks, that Arianna had just given him as a Christmas
present.

<< and to give him a motive for allying with Grindelwald. >>

How does the Resurrection Stone give him a motive for allying with
Grindelwald? 

Marianne wrote in
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/183951>:

<< I'm sure the students have the same feelings about the opposite sex
as the kids in the muggle world. I wonder if there could have been
instances of very young marriages and having children very young in
the WW. >>

It seems to be normal for wizards (Weasleys, Potters) to get married
and start their families as soon as they leave Hogwarts, when they are
only 18 years old (still 17 for the ones with summer birthdays).
(Students who left after their OWLs would be 16 rather than 18, but I
don't think canon gives any explicit information about students
leaving after their OWLs. We can guess that Stan Shunpike and
Mundungus Fletcher did so, but there is no evidence that either of
them is married, let alone got married directly upon leaving school.)

There used to be people on this list who complained bitterly about the
bad example James and Lily had set for young readers. Those listies
seemed to believe that in our world no one, not even wizards, is
mature enough to marry until at least age 24, a conflict of opinion
with Rowling who thought it was just fine that her parents had married
when they were 20.

And, of course, marrying people off in their teens, sometimes as young
as 12, was perfectly normal in the Bible and classical Greece and Rome
and Medieval Europe and big parts of 19th century America.

However, I think the above question was whether Hogwarts students ever
get pregnant and 'have to get married' before leaving Hogwarts.

I believe not, because after it happened a few times under the
Founders themselves, they started a policy of providing contraceptive
spells. Maybe they instructed the House Elves to put contraceptive
potions in the food served to students in the Great Hall, altho' that
would ruin a bit in my fanfic where Snape caught Draco and Pansy
making out behind the greenhouses and assigned Pansy the punishment of
handcopying an entire book -- which happened to be titled 'Easy
Contraceptive Spells'.

I am absolutely certain that the wizarding folk have reliable pro- and
anti- fertility magic, because historically in our Muggle world we
know that magicians were working vigorously in that area of magic even
before writing was invented.

<< One last observation. I'd never thought the adult Malfoys,
especially Draco's father, capable of showing affection or love until
Narcissa begged Snape to protect Draco. >>

I always thought Lucius and Narcissa married each other for love as
well as each thinking the other the most eligible partner available
(eligible: pureblood, rich, aristocratic, ambitious, young,
goodlooking, same opinions), but I, too, doubted whether they
particularly loved Draco until that scene you mention; I thought Draco
was probably lying when he said his father thought of sending him to
Durmstrang but his mother didn't want him sent so far from home.

One of my old theories, with no support from Rowling, explains why so
many Death Eater children were born the same academic year as Harry:
well before the Prophecy that Snape overheard and reported to
Voldemort, LV had enountered another prophecy, that said that a boy
conceived in the Autumn of 1979 would have unknown great powers and
bring victory to his father's leader, and therefore LV sought to
maximise the chance of this boy being fathered by one of his own
followers (and bringing victory to him) by ordering all his Death
Eaters to go out and spawn. To me, Lucius and Narcissa, altho' well
aware of their responsibility to provide an heir to the Malfoy name,
had planned to put that off until they were 50 (I took the wizarding
long lifespans and Dumbledore being 150 years old more seriously than
it turns out JKR did), and only did it early because of that command
from the Dark Lord.

Mike Crudele wrote in
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/183955>:

<< I think there's a lot of truth in what Dumbledore said about
Riddle/Voldemort. Much of which his supporters didn't understand.
They seem to think that performing well for Voldemort will make him
appreciate them more and raise one to the position of trusted ally and
confidant. >>

I think Lucius, before Azkaban, was even more ambitious/deluded than
that. To me, he thought that with his charm, good looks, and high
breeding, he could make Lord Voldemort dote on him as much (altho' not
as blatantly) as Hepzibah Smith had doted on Tom Riddle, and thus
Voldemort, ruler of wizarding Britain, would give any order that dear
Lucius had flatteringly suggested to him, so that Lucius would be the
REAL ruler and LV only the figurehead. I think LV knew perfectly well
that that was Lucius's plan.