CHAPDISC: DH26, Gringotts

[Carol]

No: HPFGUIDX 184064

> CHAPTER DISCUSSION: Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows
> Chapter 26, Gringotts
<snip action-filled summary> 
> Questions:
> 
> 1. HRH plan on using "a single long, coarse black hair (plucked from
the sweater Hermione had been wearing at Malfoy Manor)" (DH 519). This
might remind our readers of another time HRH attempted to use
polyjuice potion.  As you were reading did you have any fears that
this attempt might end as poorly as the previous?

Carol responds:
They've attempted to use polyjuice potion several times, first in CoS
(not disastrous, unles you count Hermione's hospital wing stint for a
furry face, but not productive). The raid on the MoM, though it
resulted in Yaxley's learning about 12 GP and Ron's being splinched,
wasn't disastrous, either. I didn't think about the one genuinely
disastrous expedition, to Godric's Hollow. I did think it was risky to
pose as someone as recognizable as Bellatrix, though. I knew the whole
expedition was risky, especially with Griphook along as untrustworthy
temporary ally, but I didn't anticipate anything like what actually
happened.
> 
> 2. Why do the trio align themselves with Griphook?  Why not ask for
Bill's help?  Would Bill help them?  Why doesn't Harry even consider
this idea?

Carol:
Harry promised Dumbledore that he wouldn't tell anyone about the
Horcruxes, which immediately rules out Bill. They'd have to tell him
why they were breaking into the Gringotts vault and why they were
destroying the cup. (Griphook doesn't need to be told that the object
is a Horcrux or that they intend to destroy it; all he needs to know
is that they intend to steal it but not for personal gain.) Also, even
though Bill works with Goblins (and used to work as a Curse breaker
and treasure seeker in the Egyptian pyramids--does that make him a
grave robber?), he probably doesn't know the location of the Lestrange
vault or how to get past its protections. Griphook does. (Harry may
think that Griphook can open the vault by scratching the door with his
fingernail as he did in SS/PS, but, of course, Griphook is no longer a
Gringotts Goblin.) Griphook, of course, is considerably easier to hide
than Bill; two wizards under an Invisibility Cloak would be very risky
in this venture. He (Griphook) fits more easily in the cart. He's
sneakier by far than Bill, but that could be an advantage. And he's
highly motivated; he wants the Sword of Gryffindor--whether or not
it's rightfully his or the Goblins' in general, he'll do what it takes
to get them into the Lestranges' vault. (Getting HRH out again,
however, does not seem to be part of his plan.)
> 
> 3. Harry has the sudden urge to destroy Bellatrix's wand when he is
reminded of the spells it has performed.  Is this rational?

Carol:
Well, no, but emotional responses by definition aren't rational. it's
a gut reaction. I suppose we could say that the spells a wand casts
are not the wand's fault, but, still, this wand chose Bellatrix
Lestrange and is compatible with her. If what Ollivander says about
wands learning along with their masters, this wand is, in a sense, her
partner in crime. Even if we don't grant wands that degree of
sentience, it's certainly an instrument of torture. IMO, even if one
of the Trio had clearly "won" that wand, teh wand would sense their
aversion to it and know them as an enemy. The complexities that
Ollivander hints at in wand ownership would come into play. Hermione
overcomes her aversion (and the fact that she didn't win the wand)
sufficiently to use it effectively (it may help that she's a powerful
Witch and it's a powerful wand), but she says that it doesn't feel
right to her and I'm quite sure that she'll be happy to exchange it
for a new one. (BTW, we don't get a similar reaction from Voldemort
with the Elder Wand, which is quite compatible with him despite his
not having won it--a powerful instrument of murder in the hands of a
powerful murderer. just my opinion.)
> 
> 4. Why does Ollivander make Luna and Luna alone a new wand?  Why not
make new wands for all of the people who were incarcerated with him?
Why not make new wands for as many people as possible who have been
victimized as he was by Death Eaters?  Why doesn't Ollivander think
about arming the enemies of his enemy?  What does this say about his
character?

Carol:
Only Luna spent any time with him. Dean and Griphook came in at the
same time as HRH, and since Mr. Ollivander spent his time at Shell
Cottage recuperating, he probably didn't get to know them well. True,
he might have made a wand for his rescuers (though technically it was
a now-dead House-Elf who got him out of the Malfoys' secret room),
but, again, he wouldn't have formed the bond with them that he did
with Luna and they do have wands, two of them "won" by their
possessors, so technically, only Luna and Dean need wands. It's
completely understandable, to me, at least, that he'd give a wand to
the sweet girl who made his imprisonment endurable and overlook the
equally wandless boy he doesn't know. as for making wands for as many
people as possible, I imagine that it's quite a complicated process
and he wouldn't necessarily have the materials at hand. (Where did he
get them, anyway? I don't suppose there are wand trees growing near
Auntie Muriel's house, much less the materials for the cores. Maybe he
borrowed a wand and summoned them from his shop? He can't have opened
the shop again as he's still in a "safe house" under the Fidelius Charm.)
> 
> 5. Is Harry's plan to withhold the Sword of Gryffindor from Griphook
a double-cross?  Should Harry have explained their need of the sword
(withholding certain details of course) and do something to ensure
that Griphook would allow them to use it for a while?  Were you
comfortable with Harry's decision?  Or did you agree with Hermione?

Carol:
I'm much more comfortable with this decision than with Harry's Crucio
or even the Imperius Curses. He did need the sword and he did intend
to give it to Griphook when he no longer needed it. (The validity of
Griphook's claim doesn't seem to concern him as it would me. I'd have
pointed out to Ron and Hermione that Gryffindor probably *did* pay for
the sword and that it apparently belongs not to the Goblins but to the
House of Gryffindor based on what Scrimgeour said.) At any rate, it's
not a double cross as he did intend to pay Griphook for his services.
He just intended to delay the payment. It's not the most ethical
decision Harry has ever made, but they can't pass up the opportunity
to steal the cup and they need the sword to destroy it. Maybe Harry
expected to destroy the Horcrux in front of Griphook, who probably
wouldn't know what it was but would certainly see that it was an evil
object associated with Voldemort. If Griphook saw Harry's need and
that Harry was telling the truth, maybe he'd have agreed to wait for
the sword (or even have realized that it wasn't rightfully his). OTOH,
without any such demonstration, Griphook, being neither trusting nor
trustworthy himself, could not be expected to understand that Harry
would pay him as soon as he'd finished with the sword. Anyway, if
we're going to argue that the Imperius Curse and other less than
admirable tactics (such as stealing and bank robbery) are necessary to
accomplish the goal of destroying Voldemort, stretching the truth and
delayed fulfillment of a promise seem excusable as well. It's not as
if Harry intended either to steal the sword or to actually break his
promise. In the end, it's Griphook, calling them thieves and leaving
them to be swallowed up by burning and replicating treasures, is the
more faithless, or rather, treacherous.

Carol, who wants to finish answering the questions, but the lights are
flickering and there's a thunderstorm coming, so I'd better get off
the computer