CHAPDISC: 34, The Forest Again.

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 185064

> Kamion to pippin
> 
> Interesting vieuw that the "veteran"-part is covered by the 
> Maraunders,pippin,
> but it is a rather forced approuch I think.

Alla:

I do not think so at all.

Kamion:
 The only one who is the 
> veteran in this is Lupin, the other are either casualty of war, 
> prisoner of war and fugitive - instead of hiding in Paraguay like 
> Mengele Wormtail is hiding in a ratskin.

Alla:

Um, maybe we should agree on definitions then. Who are in your 
opinion veterans of war? Why people who fought the war for several 
years do not count? Before Sirius went to Azkaban, he did fight the 
war for at least three years, no? How come he does not count as 
veteran for you?

Before Pettigrew switched we can safely assume that he fought in the 
Order for two years at least, no?

How come he does not count as veteran? I mean, the fact that he is a 
traitor does not mean that he is not a veteran, no?

What about Snape? Pippin was not talking just about Marauders, but 
Marauders generation and Snape fought in that war for several years 
before he start to teach. Why do you dismiss him as a veteran?

I am not sure I understand your approach.

Kamion:
> Of Lupin we don't see very much other that his coping as a werewolf 
> in the Wizard society and that determinates his behaviour far more 
> that deeds and trauma's of the past. 

Alla:

How do you figure that? I mean I agree his werewolf problems shaped 
his character too, but you are really arguing that him remembering 
all too well the times when Order was outnumbered 20:1 does not 
matter for analysing his behavior?

Kamion:
> Sirius is fighting with demons still, but that is with the demons 
> gained in AZkaban, 
> from after the war caused by his treatement by the establisment, 
then 
> caused by the war itself.

Alla:

And again how do you figure that? Sirius was on the front lines of 
the war for three four years before he went to Azkaban.

Kamion:
> When the Maraunders listen to a model/scedule I am tempt to say, 
it's 
> more that of schoolmates and what has become of them. But even that 
> doesn't pull the car. The Maraunders is past and present are 
nothing 
> more then an extention of Harry's father image. <SNIP>

Alla:

So we are just discarding them fighting in the Order for years? 
That's your right to do so of course, but I am definitely not going 
to reduce them to extension of Harry's father image. JMO of course.


Kamion:
> OK, a bit of long and winding piece to say JKR did not write 
> the "veteran"-book. And if we had not heard it blubbing from her in 
> some intervieuw, we would neither go looking for it in the books.

Alla:

That's your opinion. Mine is that had JKR never said it in the 
interview, I would not have gone looking for Harry behaving as a 
scarred veteran at the end of course, but I most definitely always 
associated Marauders generation with battle scarred, very badly hurt 
veterans of war. I do not need to go **look** for it, it is staring 
me in the face.

And Snape to me is definitely among them, young man, who albeit 
fought on the wrong side, however I also can see him being 
traumatised and badly.

Kamion:
> I doubt someone who reads this books with interest and doesn't dig 
in 
> intervieuws and fanwritings or opinions, but just analyses the work 
> with an open mind, would come to the idea JKR used the veteranmodel.

Alla:

I guess that means I analyse her work with closed mind?