James and Sirius as Bullies (WAS: student!Snape keeping Lupin's ...)

[Carol]

No: HPFGUIDX 181204

Carol earlier:
> > I agree with you that it's one teenage boy daring another to show
 he's not afraid and tempting him with bait he can't refuse. But
*Sirius knows what's in there*--a fully grown werewolf who is not
restrained in any way--and *he knows how to encounter the werewolf
safely*, which Severus doesn't.
> 
> Mike:
> My answer is still the same. Sev knows he, along with the rest of
the school, is suppose to stay away from the Willow. He knows what the
Marauders are doing is wrong, and him doing it doesn't make it right.
He highly suspects that Lupin is a werewolf and knows that Lupin is
being secreted at the end of that tunnel. That he doesn't know how 
the Marauders are getting away with it, surviving a werewolf 
encounter, makes it even more ridiculous that he would attempt it 
anyway. Sirius tells him how to get past the Willow and *probably* 
taunts him. So what?

Carol responds:
I'm not saying that Sirius forced Severus to go down there. I'm saying
that he offered him the means of endangering himself, which he could
not have done otherwise because he didn't know how to get in, knowing
that he would take the bait. Moreover, he was withholding key
information--he and his friends could face the werewolf without being
injured because they were Animagi. Severus, as James realized, could
not do so without being bitten. 

I'm not saying that Severus was innocent. Of course, he broke curfew,
and of course proving his theory and perhaps wanting to get MWPP into
trouble was insufficient reason for going in there. He suspected that
he'd see a werewolf and come out unscathed, just as the Marauders did.
He's curious, he wants to prove himself right, and he thinks he's
protected against danger. Sirius is taking advantage of those desires
and beliefs, tempting him with an offer he can't refuse and
withholoding key information. Do you really think that if Severus had
known that WPP were Animagi and in no danger from the werewolf that he
would have gone down there, having no such protection himself?

Mike:
> I'll give you my analogy. It's like one thief (Sirius) robbed a
house and gave the house key he had to a second thief (Severus). The
first thief knows the owner is in there with a shotgun. The second
thief doesn't know that for sure, but suspects it. But the second
thief figures if the first thief got away with it, he can too. The
first thief failed to mention that he had previously ascertained that
the owner was out of ammunition when he robbed the place. So, is it
the first thief's fault if the second thief gets shot trying to rob
the house? I doubt the authorities will look at it that way. <snip>

Carol responds:
Your thief analogy fails to take into account that the first thief is
safe from the shotgun (let's make it a pistol, which is more likely to
be a deadly weapon) is wearing a bullet-proof vest, which he doesn't
bother to tell the second thief about. He not only has an advantage
that enables him to face danger with impunity, he doesn't bother to
tell the second thief this crucial bit of information. He tricks the
second thief into endangering his life through pretending that they're
on equal terms.

Yes, Severus was wrong and stupid to act on the information that
Sirius provided. He should have realized that Sirius was withholding
key information and that he wanted something more than to get Severus
in trouble. (He wanted to terrigy him, at the very least.) James, to
his credit, realized that Severus didn't have that information or that
protection, and saved his life. (He also saved Remus from an action
that would have had terrible consequences for *him*. Sirius never gave
*him* a thought.)

Of the two, the one who provided information that would tempt the
other was more at fault, just as Mephistopheles, the tempter, is more
at fault than Faust, who submits to the temptation. Faust would not
have fallen, and Severus would not have entered the Shrieking Shack
and been endangered, if their tempters had not known their weaknesses
and made offers that they couldn't refuse.

Who is more at fault, the kid who offers another kid an illegal drug,
tempting him by saying that he'll love the high it give him, or the
kid who stupidly accepts the offer? Had it not been for the first kid,
he would not have been in danger of becoming a drug addict.

In short, deliberately enticing another person into danger is a worse
offense than foolishly accepting the offer. Severus could have been
killed or turned into a werewolf; Sirius, had that happened, would
have certainly been expelled and perhaps sent to Azkaban. Remus would
have been imprisoned or put to death, perhaps soul-sucked.

Just a harmless Prank, and it's all Severus's fault for falling for
it. Sorry, Mike. I can't agree with you on this one. it was only
harmless because James iintervened (or got cold feet, if Snape is
right). Had he not done so, the consequences for Severus, Remus, and
Sirius himself would have been serious indeed--far more serious than
the consequences for breaking curfew, which MWPP do every full-moon
lit night, again with potentially deady consequences.

Carol, noting that reckless endangerment is a crime and the
gullibility of the victim is no excuse