Blowing his cover

[Steve]

No: HPFGUIDX 181451

---  Lee Kaiwen <leekaiwen at ...> wrote:
>
> Zara blessed us with this gem On 10/02/2008 14:40:
> 
> 
> CJ:
> > I'm not convinced that expectorating is justification for
> > torture
> 
> zgirnius:
> > If I thought Harry Cruciated Amycus because of his 
> > discourtesy  to a teacher, I might agree with you.
> 
> ...
> 
> ...
> 
> Amycus is plotting to blame the Ravenclaws. Now, Harry? 
> Now? Crucio? Umm, Harry?
> 
> Nope. Harry still doesn't make a move.
> 
> Not until:
> 
> DH> And he spat in her face.
> 
> Ooh, now THAT did it!
> 
> DH> Harry pulled the Cloak off himself, raised his wand, and
> said, "You DH> shouldn't have done that."
> 
> Done what? Crucio the students? Nope. Make them the fall 
> guys for Alecto? Nope again.
> 
> DH> As Amycus spun around, Harry shouted, "Crucio!"
> 
> It wasn't Amycus' threats against the students that provoked
> Harry Crucio (that only merited a Stun at best). It wasn't 
> the terror in the Ravenclaws' eyes. It was the spittle 
> running down McGonagall's nose. By Harry's own admission:
> 
> DH> "Potter!" whispered Professor McGonagall, clutching her
> heart.
> DH> "Potter -- you're here! What--? How--?" She struggled to
> pull
> DH> herself together. "Potter, that was foolish!"
> DH>
> DH> "He spat at you," said Harry.
> 
> > Additional evidence of his emotional state, as I see it, 
> > is the way the spell works when he casts it. 
> 
> Even if Harry IS all wound up about his friends and fellow 
> students (though, as we've seen, not more than a Stunning 
> spell's worth), then it simply becomes a crime of passion. 
> But a crime of passion is still a crime.
> 
> Nevertheless, we still have Harry's own admission: "He spat 
> at you!" The passage just doesn't support any other 
> interpretation.
> 
> CJ
>

bboyminn:

Sorry, I'm just not buy this, not any part of it. Surely 
you have heard the expression 'the straw that broke the
camel's back'. Harry is restraining himself, but even in
that restraint, he knows he's going to have to fight
Amycus at some point, it's just a question of when.

Now Amycus can rant and rave all he wants too, but up until
the 'Spit', Harry has some underlying assumption that 
McGonagall has some control over the situation. That she 
will, if necessary, defend the students when the time 
comes. But, once Amycus spits at McGonagall it become clear
that McGonagall has lost all authority and respect at the
school. She is going to be powerless to stop what Amycus
is professing.

And so, it has gone too far, the situation is about to
get out of control, and likely McGonagall is in real 
danger.

Also, I thoroughly object to the characterization that Harry
'tortured' Amycus. I mean can you really torture someone 
for ONE SECOND? Really? If that's true then I must be 
torturing myself on a daily basis, because hardly a day
goes by when I don't cause myself one second's pain. And
on some days, I certainly cause myself excruciating pain.
Yet, that is not called 'torture', it is called life.

Yes, Harry used the 'Pain' curse, and yes it did cause pain,
but really, can we consider one or two seconds pain as
torture by any reasonable standard? I really don't think so.

My point is, and I have made it MANY times before, is that
context matters. In the context of his actions, and in the
context of the situation, I think even knowing full details,
the school, the government, and the citizens of the wizard
world are very much and very easily going to forgive Harry
his actions.

And this is very much a War Time situation. Amycus and Alecto
as well as others have brutally abused staff and students,
and that is only a taste of what is to come if they win. 
They have taken control of Hogwarts by means that would
appear to be legal at the time, but means that are going to
be considered wholly illegal and immoral after the fact.
Not to mention VOLDEMORT IS ON HIS WAY! They are invading a
stronghold of the enemy; once that is know, likely the Boss 
and a ton of re-enforcements are going to be on their way. If 
this wasn't a justifiable emergency situation, then no 
emergency has ever existed.

Even if Harry was called before the court to answer for all 
his uses of 'Unforgivable Curses', I have no doubt that in
very case, those curses would easily be forgiven, because in
the context that they occurred and in the context that he
applied them, I think they were, and the courts would find,
them justifiable. We don't crucify our heroes, not in the 
face of victory.

Or so says I.

Steve/bboyminn