CHAPDISC: DH11, The Bribe

[Carol]

No: HPFGUIDX 180526

> Chapter Discussions: Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows, Chapter
11, The Bribe

Carol:
Thanks for a delightful summary that made me chuckle a couple of
times. Now what could have made you volunteer for this particular
chapter? <eg> 

BTW, I couldn't figure out for the longest time who the "old woman"
was in the illustration heading this chapter in the Scholastic
edition. It couldn't be Bathilda, who belongs to a later chapter.
Finally, I realized that it's supposed to be Lupin. (Come on, now. He
may be prematurely grey and lined, but JKR refers to his "young face"
in both PoA and OoP. Oh, well. Mary Grandpre's Snape, especially in
OoP, comes nowhere near my view of him, either. Happy birthday, Sevvie!) 
>  
> QUESTIONS:
> 1. It seems the DE's learned where the house must be and that it
belongs to Harry, but not that it was once headquarters of the Order.
Did you think this was a clue to Snape's true loyalties? Or did you
think the tongue-tying curse was adequate to keep Snape from talking?

Carol:
I was sure that it was a clue to Snape's loyalties (though I confess
to moments of doubt elsewhere in the book). I thought that, if
anything, he would use the tongue-tying curse as a cover for not
telling LV about the HQ's location (assuming that LV questioned him
about the Fidelius Charm's still being in effect). It still seems
unlikely that Bellatrix and Narcissa wouldn't have figured it out on
their own by now, but I'll just suspend my disbelief on that point.  
> 
> 2. Does Harry's reaction to Scrimgeour's death hint at his reaction
to learning the truth about Snape?

Carol:
foreshadow it, you mean? Maybe. So far, he's the third person in the
book (counting Kreacher as a person) who isn't as bad as Harry thought
he was, Dudley being the first. But Harry puts Scrimgeour, who was
never particularly important in his life, out of his thoughts much
more quickly than he can do with Snape, who seemed like more of an
antagonist and yet did a lot more to protect him and help to defeat
Voldemort than Scrimgeour did (which is not to disparage Scrimgeour in
any way; I always thought it was unfortunate the he and Harry couldn't
trust each other and work together. I also think it's unfortunate that
Scrimgeour had to die, but JKR wanted the MoM to fall, with no
competent adults fighting the DEs while Harry is Horcrux hunting.)
> 
> 3. The DE's were  able to force their way past the protections put
on the other safe houses. Did you expect this and did it make you feel
any differently about the value of the blood protection at Privet Drive? 
> 
Carol:
I didn't expect it at all. It doesn't say much for the Aurors that the
DEs and their Ministry allies got past their protections, which
evidently didn't include any Fidelius Charms. And yet those
protections were strong enough to throw Voldemort back when he was
chasing Harry and, IIRC, deflect his Avada Kedavra. Good question
about the blood protection at Privet Drive. Except for the Dementors,
which weren't even sent by LV, it seems untested, but evidently it
prevented the DEs from seeing Harry until he broke free of it and left
"home" forever. So, now that you mention it, I do think we're meant to
realize that the blood protection was as good as both DD and LV
thought it was. (I never doubted its effectuality, myself.)

> 4. Does the  general mistrust in the wizarding community and the
surveillance and torture of Order members go far enough to explain the
lack of resistance to Voldemort's coup?

Carol:
Not really. The Order should have recruited more members back in OoP,
and torture shouldn't stop them from resisting. Nor should such a huge
number of Muggle-borns (as we see later) be at the mercy of a small
force of DEs, most of whom have no more brains than Stan Shunpike. I
think the fall of the Ministry (which neither can nor will protect the
citizens of the British WW) is the biggest factor in the unwillingness
of the citizenry to fight. And we know from Arthur Weasley how people
reacted to the Dark Mark over their houses in VW1. Still, you'd think
that the Muggle-borns would hide among their Muggle friends or
*something.*
> 
> 5. Harry accuses Lupin both of feeling a bit of a daredevil and of
being a coward. What is Rowling saying about the relationship between
recklessness and true bravery? 

Carol:
This confrontation was one of my favorite moments in DH, especially
when Harry accuses Lupin of feeling like a daredevil and imitating
Sirius. The implication seems to be that Lupin is tempting death, as
Sirius did not only by going to the Mom but by fighting Bellatrix on
the dais of the Veil. Lupin, he's suggesting, wants to die
spectularly, too, with the difference being that this suicide by
recklessness would in his case be supremely irresponsible and cowardly
because it would be a way of freeing himself of the burden of caring
for his wife and child while looking like a brave soldier dying for
the cause of the WW. JKR, I think, is speaking through Harry in
calling Lupin a coward, and Lupin, though he storms out, apparently
comes to share this view, as indicated by his behavior in later
chapters. Yes, Lupin is an adult and was his teacher, but Lupin is
wrong in this instance, and Harry is right to tell him so, IMO. Lupin
chose to marry Tonks and to father a child with her; now he has to pay
the consequences, one of which is to think of others before he thinks
of himself. I think that JKR is saying that Marauder-style
recklessness was bad enough when it endangered the people of
Hogsmeade; in this instance, it would endanger Lupin's own family by
depriving them of his protection. True bravery isn't rushing
heedlessly into danger; it's facing the consequences of your own
actions without running away.
> 
> 6. What do you think of Lupin's reasons for wanting to leave his
family? Given earlier hints in canon that Lupin is an occlumens, is
his apparent lack of feeling for Tonks only a pretense, or is he truly
indifferent?

Carol responds:
I'm not going to get into whether Lupin is an Occlumens (or
Legilimens) because the hints are never resolved in canon and I'm not
sure they apply here. However, I think he must have loved Tonks or he
wouldn't have married her. I certainly see his reasons for rejecting
her--the age difference, his being a werewolf, his poverty--as the
legitimate reasons a responsible man would give for refusing the love
of an attractive young woman who could easily find a more suitable
husband if she wished to. If he loved her, his wish for her safety and
happiness would be all the more reason to refuse her. I think he must
have given in, partly because she had confessed her love in front of
so many people, all of whom seemed to be pressuring him to let love
triumph, and because he had been lonely and rejected all his life, and
being loved and wanted seemed worth the risk. Then, of course, he
realized that he'd endangered her just by marrying her (the Bellatrix
factor) and he discovered that she was pregnant and he feared the
birth of "cubs" who would share his curse. Weak to begin with, he
seems to have nearly broken under the strain. Joining Harry's
seemingly doomed quest to do he didn't know what seemed like a way out
of his dilemma. Once that option was closed to him (not that it was
ever really open), he returned home and, apparently, found happiness
with his young wife and her mother. (His claim that they rejected him
sounds like a lie to me. I can't see any member of the Tonks family
doing that.) Interesting that he later adopts the nickname that
Tonks's parents used for her, Dora.
> 
> 7. It is an axiom of political science that every new regulation
creates an opportunity for graft. Did Scrimgeour's attempts to
restrict the selling of magical devices (HBP ch 5) do more harm than good?

Carol:
Erm, which restrictions? I can't answer the question without more
information.
> 
> 8. On a lighter note, I think this is at least the seventh time that
canon refers to Umbridge as a hag. Could she actually be one? 

Carol:
If she were, she'd have eaten the children in pies rather than
torturing them with her quill. <eg> Seriously, I think she really is
related to Selwyn (who provides her later with Mad-Eye's eye).
Besides, she looks like a toad, and I picture hags as having huge
hooked noses that touch their prominent, hairy chins. I think HRH are
using "hag" pretty much as Muggle kids would to refer to an "old"
(middle-aged) woman they considered exceptionally mean or cruel (in
this case, with justification).
> 
> 
> Pippin, with thanks to SSSusan for proofreading, 
> 
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