Wands and Wizards...Again (Was: Epilogue ...)

[montavilla47]

No: HPFGUIDX 183739

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Jen Reese" <stevejjen at ...> wrote:
>
> > Montavilla47:
> > Again, you seem to think I want something different to happen.  
> > I don't actually.  I'm simply telling you what message I'm getting
> > from what *does* happen.
> > 
> > You can get a different message, if you like.  I certainly don't 
> > mind.  But I can't help noticing that, in order to get that 
> > different message, we would need to infer things that don't happen
> > in the books.  Such as Hermione taking up House-Elf rights at a
> > later point.
> 
> Jen: You don't have to infer that though, you just have to infer that 
> Hermione's fundamental character didn't change as is being postulated 
> in the other thread, and that she continues to care about house elf 
> rights like she always has.  
> 
> You answered my previous question in this post, and just like you 
> would have to see an action such as Hermione demanding Harry give 
> Kreacher clothes in order to believe she's anti-slavery (or other 
> example that fits for you), I would need to hear Hermione say she no 
> longer believes there's a problem with the house elves, that their 
> condition is just fine with her, in order to make the conclusion that 
> she's reversed her previous thinking and is now pro-slavery.  It's 
> not there.  She continues to care about their welfare, she continues 
> to exhibit a passion for injustice in other areas of DH.  As far as I 
> can see, nothing's changed except the focus & scope at this 
> particular point in Hermione's life.  I don't have to extrapolate 
> that she does anything else later off-page to think she continues to 
> believe what she always has about house elves.

Montavilla47:
You know, Jen, I think you're right.  I went to far in saying that
Hermione became "pro-slavery."   

But I still think she changed her thinking because in GoF and
OotP, she "hotly" argues against Ron's complacent attitude
toward the slavery issue--and yet, she says nothing about
it in HBP when Harry owns Kreacher and even when he forces
Kreacher to do things that Kreacher clearly doesn't want to 
do.  Harry even worries that Hermione will disapprove, but 
she doesn't... although she's willing to disapprove of other
things Harry does, like using the Prince's notes.

I don't think that Hermione needs to be perfect in order to
be a good, interesting, or likeable character, but this 
contradiction makes her seem shallow.  She's willing to stand
up to Harry when it comes to Harry doing something that
puts him ahead of her in class, but not when Harry is doing
something that goes against her political principles.

If we had had a confrontation about Kreacher between 
Hermione and Harry in HBP--and actual debate about the
problem--then it would be easier to accept the idea that
Hermione is re-thinking her position.

Instead, we get that strange (to me, YMMV) moment in
DH when Hermione tearfully points out to Harry that 
it's awful that Kreacher is beating himself up and he 
should do something.  It's strange to me, because OF
COURSE Harry is going to stop Kreacher from beating
himself up.  Not only did Harry stop Dobby from doing
that--even when he was pretty upset with Dobby--but
Kreacher's self-punishment is interfering with what 
Harry wants, which is to know what happened to the darn 
locket.

So, Hermione's tearful reminder that elves should be
stopped from hurting themselves adds nothing, changes
nothing, and only serves to show that Hermione doesn't
like seeing elves hurt themselves.... which... who does?

You and others remind me that Hermione mentions
her commitment to House-Elf rights when talking to 
Griphook.  I will confess that I had forgotten that moment,
partly because it seemed irrelevant to anything, except
trying to get Griphook to help them.  (It was sort of like her
saying that she's against global warming when we know
that she's fine with Harry driving an SUV, and gladly took
rides in it.  Or saying she's against factory farms, when
she buys groceries without bothering to check whether 
the chickens are free range or not.)

And then, the final crowning moment of the S.P.E.W.
storyline is when Hermione is so impressed by Ron
remembering the existence of the elves at Hogwarts 
that she forgets the entire war and starts making out
with him.  In remembering the elves and thinking about
their welfare--as if they were people--Ron is doing
*exactly* what he would have done in GoF or OotP.  He
hasn't changed at all--but Hermione treats it like 
he's made some huge step toward enlightenment.

Which, again, makes Hermione and her political 
cause seem shallow.  It's no longer about the
elves--it's about her hormonal response to Ron.

Montavilla47