GoF CH 27-29 Post DH look/ Snape and Harry redux

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 182193

Magpie:
Well, yeah. But--and I'm not saying that you're disagreeing with
this--I think Snape's personal responsibility for what happened is
one of those Very Important Events that Changed Everything and even
if the Potters *could* have died some other way, they didn't and
that doesn't change that Snape took action to get someone killed and
those someone's were the Potters. Not because James and Lily would
have been assured a long and healthy life otherwise--but they
certainly might have had one. As Alla pointed out, other Order
members were still alive come the end of VWI.

Alla:

Precisely, you put it in exact words I wanted to say. Very Important 
Event that changed everything, that is all what I am saying, and just 
as I am agreeing that obviously Potters COULD have died any other 
way, I will never agree that the absence of such event did not give 
them a chance not to die.

Because Voldemort picking order members one by one did not lead to 
EVERY order member's death, because Lily and James **did** defy 
Voldemort three times, so who is to say that they would not have 
continued to defying him? Because Peter was already betraying the 
order for a year and I do not remember the books connecting anybody 
else's death to his betrayal. I mean, it is only the fact that 
Potters had to go into hiding due to Snape's blabbing the prophecy 
caused the need for Secret keeper in the first place.

Of course Peter's betrayal could have caused any major damage and 
could have lead to Potters' deaths in any other way, but maybe not. 
Maybe Peter's betrayal would have been discovered before any deaths 
could occur, etc.

Boy do I miss wild speculating, hehe. My point is that Snape changed 
everything and without him doing that, the events **could** have 
transpired in a majorly different way. IMO.

Magpie:
<SNIP>
I think that's the important thing about Snape, that he's a
character who actually took responsibility for the unintended (but
foreseeable) consequences of his actions and worked to counteract
them.
<SNIP>

Alla:

Oh sure. I would prefer him to take responsibility in a little bit 
different way as well, but he definitely did take it.

Leah: You can't say that there was no possibility of James and Lily
living once Voldemort knew the prophecy, though there was clearly a
reduced possibility. <SNIP>.


Alla:

I believe can say that, because while of course as you described 
there was a reduced possibility of them surviving after prophecy, 
that was not quite my speculation, sorry for being unclear.

The only variable that changes in my speculation is the absence of 
that very important event, nothing else.

Potioncat:
So...as if the WW is real, not as if an author had to create a story.
As if we had Time Turners and could go back and fix things.

I think if a witch went back and Obliviated Snape so that he couldn't
tell the prophecy, events would still have led to the Potters' death,
Lily's sacrifice and Harry as the Chosen One. Maybe Harry would still
have been orphaned, or perhaps his parents would have been killed
when he was older. But I think there were enough actions in place
that not much would have changed. For example, Remus told Harry the
Order members were being picked off, one-by-one; and LV went after
one witch himself. The Potters had already defied him 3 times and I
think they would be targeted.

Alla:

I think I addressed it replying to Magpie. I do not get how removing 
major event would still lead to same results.  Maybe, sure everything 
is possible, but it also maybe not, you know?

I do hope that when Snape was contemplating of his role, he wished he 
would not have done it, because to me it is just as simple as that – 
without Snape,  two 21 year olds are **possibly** alive, their baby 
**possibly** has normal life, with his interference – they are not 
**for a fact**.

But I do love your imaginary witch with TT and want to use it, hehe.

Potioncat:
<SNIP>
OH THIS IS GOOD!
No Riddle
NO Death Eaters
Less Pure-blood mania
No "Your Death Eater Friends"
No "Filthy Mudblood"
We'll still have Ron and Hermione and Neville and Draco. I don't know
if we'll have "Professor" Snape. Or if we do, he'll teach DADA. It
channels his interest in Dark Arts in a healthy way. Hagrid may have
actually kept his wand and be off at a dragon preserve.

I'm not very sure what effect it'll have on Harry Potter--more like
his father James and maybe something like his mother Florence.
Perhaps he'll have a crush on the green-eyed Sylvie Snape, the
daughter of Severus and Lily Snape.

Oh, I do like your ideas Alla. It's the only way a good outcome can
happen for Snape.


Alla:

But of course, as I said as simple as that IMO – if that accident did 
not happen, it is very possible that friendship between Snape and 
Lily would not have been destroyed. One variable changes everything, 
why would I say, oh no, it is still most likely not have happened. Do 
you see the similarities? ;)

I do not know if I would go as far as agreeing with Lily and Snape 
getting married, but ONLY because in your scenario Dark Arts are 
still in existence, right?

I believe JKR did say something along the line that Lily could have 
loved Snape had he not had a personality with the interest for Dark 
Arts, yes? In your scenario, he is still interested in them, yes, 
albeit in healthy way?

So, not sure about Sylvie Snape, but hey I am willing to say that if 
their friendship had not been destroyed, maybe Lily would be able to 
talk him out or something and maybe we will have Harry Snape as in 
all those fanfictions, LOLOL.