Why should we care if Harry's not really needed? Re: Who needs Harry?

[horridporrid03]

No: HPFGUIDX 182330

> >>Alla:
> <snip>
> I guess where we differ on this speculation (with Betsy) is that I 
> have no problem suspending disbelief in the story where I know      
> child is supposed to defeat the big baddie. I know that to enjoy    
> the story I should suspend disbelief and assume that adults are    
> idiots, or do what their leader tells them or just won't bother     
> with research about Dark arts, etc, etc.
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
For me, the suspension of disbelief is a contract entered into 
*between* the author and the reader.  For example, I as the reader 
agree to throw the laws of physics and evolution out the window and 
agree that brooms can fly and dragons exist.  

But it's up to the author to make that suspension of disbelief as 
easy and seamless as possible.  For example, okay dragons exist, but 
as they're dangerous and rare beasts there's a whole career made of 
keeping them safely away from human populations and in healthy 
breeding environments.

So the author takes the unbelievable (dragons) and makes it mundane 
(dragons treated as lions).  That's part of building a believable, 
unbelievable world.  Another example: Brooms fly and we've made a 
sport of it and some brooms are cooler than others.  Brooms as 
bicycles (or polo ponies).  JKR did a good job at that.  In the 
beginning.

But than she asked far too much of me while doing far too little in 
return.

> >>Alla:
> Same with Harry Potter, no it does not sound to me believable at    
> all that nobody bothered to research the Dark arts and find out    
> about horcruxes in the meanwhile. I just accept it that it is      
> necessary for the plot, but it does not mean that I disregard this 
> as unbleievable, quite contrary.
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
JKR asked me to believe that a major threat appeared within this 
magical world and the world just lay down for him.  She asked me to 
believe that no one in the WW was interested in their own or their 
world's survival.  She asked me to believe that the one boy capable 
of defeating that great threat did so, not with skill, but through an 
*unbelievable* amount of luck. 

I can suspend disbelief and believe that dragons help guard a bank 
run by goblins.  Ask me to believe that a young boy and his plucky 
friends can waltz into that bank, steal stuff, and then escape on a 
dragon? In my opinion, that's the author falling down on her job and 
asking me to do her work for her.  It's asking me to believe a boy 
could break into Fort Knox and escape on the back of a lion.  It's 
breaking the contract.

So my issue with the Voldemort story is that JKR went sloppy.  She 
couldn't be bothered to think up a truly formidable villain, she 
couldn't be bothered to think up a good reason for Harry being the 
hero of her piece.  So she cut corners, didn't worry about plot 
holes, and had her hero save the day due to his overwhelming...luck.  
(How lucky the Fort Knox people mistreated that lion!  How lucky the 
lion was more interested in escape than attacking strangers!  How 
lucky we all managed to scramble aboard!)  JKR stopped working and 
asked me, the reader, to take up the slack.

> >>Catlady:
> In the story, Harry is the only person who can take down Voldemort,
> because that's how the story is written. The Author endowed him with
> the needed abilities and gave him lucky breaks, and decreed that
> everything everyone else tried, failed.

Betsy Hp:
Except JKR didn't allow anyone else of any skill to try anything 
against Voldemort.  That's part of the reason he looked so pathetic 
as a big evil.  We never got to see him being formidable.  If JKR had 
bothered thinking through how a people would realistically react to a 
threat like Voldemort, if she'd bothered to show them trying and 
failing, *then* I'd be forced to conclude Voldemort was no easy meat.

Of course, that means she'd have been forced to make Harry into 
something other than an *unbelievably* lucky boy.  

As far as I could tell, Harry's special skill was his luck.  Nothing 
he caused or created, just the way things fell out around him.  Lucky 
he ran across that first horcrux, lucky the big bad forgot about 
their mind link and thought about where all his other horcruxes were 
located, lucky people (other than Harry) figured out how to destroy 
the horcruxes, lucky that he stumpled across the elder wand and 
managed to get ownership of it.  (It's still amusing to me that Harry 
became the owner by complete and ignorant mistake.  And also because 
he felt like being an ass.)

I'll even give a lucky break or two.  Running across the diary 
horcrux was a stroke of luck, but it played organically (at least in 
the beginning) and could have signaled something bigger (Voldemort's 
minions not being as loyal as he'd hoped).  But then Harry kept on 
being lucky.  After a while, watching someone be really, really lucky 
gets old.  At least for me, I'd like to see some skill and effort 
come into play.

> >>Catlady:
> According to archetypal analysis (that's a New Age style of literary
> criticism), the purpose of traditional folk tales and epics where   
> the hero is the only person who can possibly accomplish the assigned
> heroic task, such as slaying the monster or stealing fire from      
> heaven, is to motivate ALL listeners to try their hardest and do   
> their damnedest to be heroic and do their duty and accomplish their 
> destiny, asserting that each person has a destiny that only they   
> can do.
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
But that's the thing.  Harry didn't come close to wowing me.  
Certainly he wasn't all that inspiring.  It's like listening to a 
lottery winner give a talk.  One day you might be lucky too?  That's 
what I'm supposed to take away from this?

By relying so heavily on her readership doing all of her work for her 
(and...um... they escape on a dragon? eh, whatever I write, they'll 
believe) by not bothering to come up with a believable plot, JKR 
broke with her readers.  She failed at her end of the contract.  And 
left me to wonder why so many unbelievable things happened in this 
world she wanted me to believe in.

At least, in my opinion.

Betsy Hp