Q 5, McGonagall (was Re: CHAPDISC: DH30, THE SACKING OF SEVERUS SNAPE

[Carol]

No: HPFGUIDX 184539

Potioncat wrote:
<snip>
> To Minerva, Carrow has been using Cruciatus on the students, and
making them use it on each other all year long. So the use of it by
Harry, and her own use of Imperius are somewhat justified---at least
in her mind. <snip>

Carol responds:

I wonder if the situation is quite as bad as a number of readers seem
to think. We see it only through the point of view of Neville, a
seventh year. He would know what Amycus is teaching students at his
level, but not what he's teaching the younger students. We hear of
only two students, Crabbe and Goyle, who actually use Cruciatus on
other students, and both of them are seventh years.

I'm not, of course, defending the despicable Amycus, but there are,
presumably, limits to his teaching abilities and definitely limits to
the learning capacities of the students. Barty Jr., another DE, told
the  fourth-years that if they all tried together to hit him with an
AK, he wouldn't get so much as a nosebleed. Bellatrix, also a DE,
tells Harry, "You have to mean them, Potter." Even near the end of his
fifth year, at a time when he's furious and filled with righteous
anger, he can't cast a successful Crucio. It only hurts Bellatrix for
a second and surprises her. It's unclear whether his and Draco's
attempted Crucios in sixth year would have been successful since
they're both thwarted, but we do know that he finally "means" the
Crucio he casts on Amycus. He *wants* to hurt him. Moral judgments
aside, it appears that only the older students, seventh years and
possibly sixth years, would have the power, the experience, the
control of their minds and wands necessary to cast a Crucio. (We don't
hear about them casting Imperius Curses, and they certainly don't cast
AKs--not even LV wants Wizard blood to be shed in the hallways of
Hogwarts, at least not until he's actively making war on those who
resist his will.)

So, the Carrows are using Crucitus as punishment and Amycus is
teaching or trying to teach it to at least some students, but I
suspect Snape would have reminded him that the younger students would
be unable to master it and possibly of the danger of its being used
against him. I think he would also, being Snape, remind *all* his
teachers of the importance of preparing the students for the OWLs and
NEWTs, which means that Amycus's students would still need to learn
standard DADA spells. (It's interesting, BTW, that Hagrid talks before
school starts about acquiring unicorns. Is he teaching to the
not-yet-modified Ministry standards this year?) Clearly, the Cruciatus
Curse is not the only thing he's taught the students. Possibly, he's
teaching Dark magic at a level commensurate with the students'
abilities (the Fiendfyre curse for the seventh years), but he's also,
surprisingly, teaching actual DADA, again, probably, at a level
suitable to their capacity to learn (no point in teaching spells they
can't yet master). Crabbe and Goyle (and Draco) have learned the
Disillusionment Charm.

What the first years or fourth years or even the sixth years are
learning in DADA, we don't know. It's only the seventh years we're
concerned with here. I doubt, however, that Slytherins and Gryffindors
(or Ravenclaws and Hufflepuffs) of any age are Crucioing each other in
the corridors, in part because the younger ones have not been taught
the curse yet and in part because some of them, including Draco, have
discovered that they have no aptitude for torture. Just knowing the
incantation is not enough: "You have to mean it, Potter." And, of
course, Snape has assigned the teachers (possibly only the heads of
House and certainly not the Carrows) to patrol the corridors.

BTW, I think that one reason that McGonagall and the others have not
openly rebelled against Snape previously (aside from not having
Harry's presence as a catalyst) is that Snape has kept everything as
normal as possible, letting them teach their classes as they always
have, allowing the students to go home for the holidays and to go to
Hogsmeade until it becomes too dangerous. (He revokes Ginny's
privilege for her own protection.) the students are still sorted. The
common rooms and dormitories are still safe havens (the Carrows can't
get in and have no reason to before LV orders them to get into the
Ravenclaw common room). The House Elves still serve the meals and make
the beds. If he'd been a real DE, bringing in the likes of Travers and
Dolohov to teach Transfiguration and Charms, conditions would have
been much worse. He assumes, I think, that the other faculty members
will undermine the Carrows as they did Umbridge and he even
reinstitutes some of her decrees to stimulate the DA to resist as well
(or so I'm guessing; I can't think of any reason for him to do it
except to protect the timid and goad the courageous into rebellion).
Even before he officially comes to Hogwarts, we see from his
acceptance speech that he's concerned with keeping up appearances, the
illusion of normalcy. That satisfies the parents and the MoM and LV
and, if I'm right, it would give him a way of dealing with the
Carrows. We must keep up appearances. The students must actually be
taught. They must pass their exams, etc. (I'm not sure how he would
deal with Alecto, maybe just making sure that she keeps the subject
matter at an appropriate grade level. His real concern would be
Amycus--and making sure that the students in the other classes learned
exactly what they would have learned with DD as headmaster.)

At any rate, bad as conditions are at Hogwarts, it's not absolute
chaos with every student either abused or abusing the others. Yes,
some students, including innocent first years, are being cruelly
punished, but most of those injured by the Carrows are, as far as I
can tell, DA members. Snape has closed off the secret passages and
retained the old faculty members. (Slughorn clearly respects him and
treats him with the respect due a headmaster but also some of his old
affection, as if he doubts that Snape killed Dumbledore.) It seems to
me that Hogwarts is as safe and normal as Snape can make it without
openly resisting the Carrows and giving himself away. He can't,
however, take away their authority over detentions (other than
assigning more humane detentions himself and allowing Mcgonagall et
al. to thwart the Carrows behind his back). Nor can he keep them from
Crucioing some students. But Hogwarts is not yet an all-Slytherin
British equivalent of Durmstrang, and no student other than Neville, 
Seamus, Michael Corner, and Terry Boot (personally beaten up by Amycus
for yelling about Harry's dragon escapade in the Great Hall) shows any
signs of injury either in the RoR or the Great Hall before the Battle
of Hogwarts begins. (Of course, Cruciatus wouldn't leave scars, so we
don't know how many people have suffered it or been given detentions
by the Carrows. The other teachers, Neville says, avoid sending
students to the Carrows. Possibly, they use the good old point system
instead. It seems to me that the Carrows's authority over detentions
is more an illusion than a reality. They control only the detentions
that they themselves assign.) 

I'm not trying to paint a rosy picture of life at Hogwarts in DH. I'm
only saying that it might appear different seen from another students'
perspective. Sure, there are no Muggle-borns and Muggle Studies is
mandatory brainwashing (rather like DADA under Umbridge only worse).
Sure, DADA is more like Dark Arts, especially for the older students,
but that class has never been good except under Lupin and Snape. Stay
out of the Carrows' way and you'll be all right. It's not as if Yaxley
or Travers or Dolohov were headmaster and all the teachers were DEs.
Good meals, a cozy common room, homework, the Hogwarts Express, the
normal holidays, even, I imagine, pumpkins at Halloween and Christmas
trees at Christmas. The ghosts, the suits of armor, Peeves the
Poltergeist, Filch and Mrs. Norris, even, probably, the moving
staircases that we never hear about in the later books, are all as
they've always been. I think that, unless a student other than the DA
members is actually in class or detention with the Carrows  or
otherwise in contact with them, that student would makd the best of
the situation. Snape is no scarier as headmaster than he was as a
teacher and actually, to judge from this chapter, quite reasonable and
civil.

I guess life at Hogwarts for most students (not those who are actually
beaten up or tortured) is rather like Harry's life with the Dursleys,
far from desirable, far from ideal, but not nearly as bad as it would
be if Snape were the loyal DE he pretends to be. (And McGonagall, I
think would realize that if only she weren't so firmly convinced that
Snape was a murdering traitor and a loyal DE. Alas, she's blinded by
her preconceptions and Snape keeps up the pretense till almost his
last breath. I wonder what McGonagall thought, hearing the truth about
Snape when it's too late and whether she was sorry that she had so
badly misjudged him--or at least sorry to lose so valuable an ally.)

Carol, wondering if NEWTs and OWLs were held that year and whether the
students from the previous year ever got to take them