Choices/Snape as abuser, SKIP if not interested WAS :Re: CHAPTER

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 188581


Julie:
So if Snape had taken Harry in when Harry was 16 months old,
you think he would have made Harry sleep in a cupboard, never
bought Harry his own clothes, made Harry work like a house elf
and never let Harry interact with anyone else, and essentially
kept Harry in a state of perpetual starvation/malnutrition?

I kind of doubt it. Yes, Harry is James' child, but he's still
a baby, thus doesn't look "just like his father" yet (the way
Harry did when he came to Hogwarts at age 11, the same age as
James' when Snape first met him). In fact, he has his mother's
startling green eyes, certainly the most prominent feature of
any baby. This could well influence how Snape initially reacts
to Harry. <SNIP>

Alla:
Sorry, but to me a person who is willing to attack eleven year old because he looks as James (obviously my opinion, but this is what I am basing it on) will not treat 16 months old (or 18 months old, whatever age Harry was when Dumbledore left him at Dursley0 any nicer, IMO of course.

But obviously I cannot say that you are wrong and I do not see how you can prove that I am wrong. I think both of us are basing our speculations on what we think of Snape's character, right? I doubt that Snape would feel much more compassion for Baby!Harry who just lost his parents than for eleven year old Harry who just arrived in the brave new world.

In fact to me it is plausible that Snape would treat Harry worse because so little time passed and he will see that his precious Lily dead and Harry is alive. I somehow doubt that Snape will see the baby as anything else but reason why Lily died and I think he will take it all out on him with vengeance.

I snipped the part where you said that it could go other way because I agree with it.

Juli:
But even if Snape hadn't been able to bring himself to care
for Harry personally, I actually can't see him forcing Harry
to sleep in a cupboard, or denying Harry food or clothing.
<SNIP>

Alla:

I can and very easily at that, as I said above I think Snape will take his guilt on Harry because he is alive and Lily is dead.

Juli:
That goes if for some reason Dumbledore had taken Harry away
from the Dursleys once Harry came to school. Even after Snape
saw Harry as James' clone, I think he would have made sure
Harry's needs were met, including decent clothing and sufficient
food. Which isn't to say lack of affection and verbal abuse
are in and of themselves not damaging. They are. But it still
something more than Petunia gave Harry. (And why I think her
wrongs against Harry are much, MUCH more deserving of harsh
punishment than any verbal abuse Snape may have delivered.)

Alla:

We would never know.

Alla:
>
> Well, the difference between our positions is that I call it abuse based on
Snape's intent and I believe JKR's words that Snape hated Harry till the day he
died.
>

Julie:
Snape hating Harry is how he feels, not what he intends with
his words and actions. If he intends to hurt and humiliate,
which I agree he does at times, that is the form of abuse to
which you are referring, I believe. I think though that Snape
also often believes he is going to "shape" Harry up, get rid
of Harry's faults that are so similar to his father's--his
supposed arrogance, his rule-breaking that is so lamentably
ignored by the Headmaster, etc. And Snape even means to teach
Harry on occasion ("That is not as bad as it might have been").
After all, he knows the boy has to defeat the Dark Lord ;-)

Alla:

Right hates is how he feels, but to me how Snape feels translates perfectly into how he acts towards Harry.


Julie,
who thinks it significant that Snape's abuse is verbal
and low-level in comparison to the Dursley's, and to what
Snape is certainly capable of and could have done if he'd
given full rein to his feelings for Harry.


Alla,

who does not attach any significance whatsoever to the fact that Snape's abuse is less than Dursleys' and for whom a character who is engages in any degree of abuse is quite a disgusting one.

P.S.
I wonder why the character who abuses *less* is supposed to get a cookie because his behavior is less disgusting by comparison with more vile character? I know another character whom I think of as much more despicable abuser  than Snape – Umbridge. But you know, I measure Snape's actions by what *he did*, not how many LESS despicable things he committed. Just imagine that we would not have Umbridge and Dursleys in the story for a second. If there is nothing to compare Snape's actions to are they better somehow? Not to me definitely not.

IMO of course and of course it is my opinion as well that I interpet Snape's actions as verbal abuse in the first place, I know not everybody shares it.