First lesson WAS: Re: Marietta, was Slytherin's Reputation

[montavilla47]

No: HPFGUIDX 185879

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "dumbledore11214" <dumbledore11214 at ...> 
wrote:
>
> > > Alla:
> > > 
> > > So that *is* the scene you meant. Okay then no I do not see them 
> as 
> > > the same at all. Because I think it is much more reasonable to 
> expect 
> > > sixth years who had DADA for several years to pick up some extra 
> > > knowledge, at least theoretical of the magic they never done 
> > > (presumably), but definitely saw in the WW.
> <SNIP>
> > 
> > Montavilla47:
> > I don't know why Snape would take that into account.  (And, it looks
> > like either *no one* besides Hermione was curious enough to look
> > that up ahead of time, or everyone besides Hermione was savvy
> > enough not to try and answer Snape's first question of the year
> > of they didn't have to. :-)
> 
> Alla:
> 
>  You do not know why Snape would take into account that it is more 
> reasonable in my view for six years to answer his question than for 
> the first years? I am just asking for clarification here, I am not 
> quite sure what you mean here by *that*. If I understood you 
> correctly, my point is not that I am sure that he will take it into 
> account, my point is that the fact that he is asking *six years* to 
> me means a major difference between how I perceive his questions 
> here. And that is why I do not think these two scenes can be compared.

Montavilla47:
Yes, I don't think Snape would take into account that it's more 
reasonable for a sixth year student to have read through the 
first few chapters of their books than for a first year to have done
so.  First year or sixth, he is putting his students on notice that 
they are expected to come to his class prepared.

And, since this is the first year that Snape is teaching D.A.D.A.,
he may well emphasis that by using the same technique he uses
in first year.

Alla:
> Originally I was saying that I do not see any evidence that Snape is 
> asking questions of the first years, or at least I was trying to say 
> that. 
> 
> And yes, nobody but Hermione seemed to bother. My point is that it is 
> more likely to me that somebody else *may* bother and more reasonable 
> for the teacher to at least see if somebody else did.

Montavilla47:
Alla, how are we supposed to provide evidence that Snape asks
questions of other first years?  We can't look into other first
year classes.  Give me proof that he doesn't!  :-)

I can point to one thing:  Ron does reassure Harry that Snape
is generally mean and took "loads" of points from the Twins.
>From *Ron's* reaction, I infer that what Snape did wasn't 
considered outrageously mean--just somewhat mean from
the POV of the average student.

Granted, Harry is more correct--because Snape *does* have
baggage and that *does* color the interaction.  But Ron's 
reaction shows us that it's really not that big a deal--just
one of the thousands of petty annoyances that students
deal with their first year--like those staircases that move
just when you're trying to get to class.  Or Peeves.

And, just in case you're going to tell me that Ron just
doesn't have the empathy to realize horrible Snape was,
I will note that in fifth year, when Harry encountered
Umbridge, a truly sadistic teacher who allowed her 
preconceptions of Harry to rule her actions, Ron was
"sickened" and advised Harry to report her immediately.

> > Alla:
> > > NOT the first years muggleborns who just only learned that magic 
> > > exists and had to deal with Snape's questioning.
> > 
> > Montavilla47:
> > Okay, this is a really minor point--which is why I haven't bothered
> > to address it before--but we don't know that Snape knows that
> > Harry just got informed about the wizarding world a month 
> > earlier. <SNIP>
> 
> Alla:
> I cannot argue with your assumption, but it makes no sense to me that 
> Dumbledore would not tell Snape where Harry went. For the simple 
> reason that Dumbledore asked Snape of protecting Harry, to me it 
> makes sense that he would tell him where he placed his protege, in 
> case Snape needs to go and protect him.

Montavilla47:
Yes, it would make sense.  But that doesn't mean Dumbledore
would do it.  Because he doesn't seem to have told Snape other things
that would have made sense as well--like the fact that Draco was 
celebrating some great accompishment on the night he and Harry went
to the cave.  That might have been good information to impart to the 
fellow charged with keeping Draco in check.

Alla:
> And it also seems to me that Snape would have easily deducted that 
> Harry is not in WW simply because he does not hear anything about him 
> till he comes back.

Montavilla47:
And again, even if Dumbedore told Snape that Harry was with his 
family, Snape might not be aware that that meant Petunia, rather
than Lily's parents.  And, even if he knew that it was Petunia, there's
no reason for him to assume she wouldn't tell Harry about being 
magical.  
 
Alla:
> I mean, again, your assumption is as good as mine of course and 
> indeed it is a minor point, but I just do not see it.

Montavilla47:
Yes.  But can you see that your assumption that Snape knew that
Harry was stepping into a world that he knew nothing about, 
is equally unsupported?