Harry Potter and Stoicism

[Carol]

No: HPFGUIDX 185896

Alla wrote:
<snip>
> Among many arguments this book makes is that JKR often shows the 
> virtues of stoicism, give or take in her good characters.
<snip>

> Anyway back to Potterverse, as I said Kern argues that among other
things Rowling shows virtues of stoicism. Do you guys agree or 
disagree and why?
> 
> I mean, I would totally say that in some ways Dumbledore is very
very stoic - restraint in everything, emotions totally ARE bad, that
he did not want to feel anything for Harry, etc.
> 
> It actually makes sense to me that Dumbledore as stoicist if he is,
would have restrained himself from ever having a love life too.
> 
> But I mean, if I understood Kern correctly, then books should show
that emotions can be destructive in the major way. And we saw it 
several times, but I would say not in a major way (IMO of course).
Like we see Peter being scared and letting the fear overcome him and
betray his friends, in fact we see Marauders' friendship being torn 
apart by conflicting emotions, no?
> 
> But at the same time we have that Love being major theme, and of 
course sacrifice, etc. Now I do not think that books having major
christian themes would have contradicted characters showing stoicism
virtues, etc, but isn't sacrificial love especially being shown as a 
good thing and nothing to be restrained of, but in fact cultivated
etc? <snip>

Carol responds:

Interesting topic, Alla. I think, first, that critics who wrote about
the HP series before all the books are out were basing their
conclusions on insufficient evidence. I can see why someone reading,
say, GoF or OoP might think that, for Rowling, Stoicism as epitomized
by Dumbledore was the ultimate wisdom, but I think that most of us see
him as less wise and less good post-DH than we did before. His
attachment to Gindelwald was certainly an error in judgment, but only
because Grindelwald was the wrong person and he should have felt a
stronger affection--familial love--for his younger brother and sister.
The bit of love he feels for Harry is almost the only quality that
humanizes him as an old man--that and his deceptively twinkly sense of
humor.

I agree with you that Love, particularly Harry's sacrificial love, is
contrary to Stoicism (and thematically tied to Christianity). Harry's
ability to feel and suffer enables him to empathize with others, even
Snape. He does overcome anger and the desire for revenge, but that's
not the same as eliminating the passions altogether. Love enables
Snape to find redemption; it effectively neutralizes the Malfoys,
turning them away from Voldemort without making them exactly good; it
saves Harry in the first place (Snape's love for Lily makes possible
her self-sacrifice, which would otherwise be just another planned
death; that self-sacrifice in turn provides the ancient Love magic
that protects Harry in various ways throughout the books, from the
original rebounded AK to the drop of blood that enables him to return
from King's Cross.) Love, sometimes combined with anger, motivates the
combatants in the Battle of Hogwarts. Percy returns to fight alongside
his family, familial love proving stronger than pride. Molly fights
(and kills) to protect her daughter after losing a son. And so on.

The other supreme virtue for JKR is clearly courage, which is not the
same as calm, level-headed fearlessness but also not the same as
adolescent recklessness. It's knowing the danger that you face and
facing it willingly, overcoming fear but nevertheless still feeling
it. We see that sort of courage with Lily telling Voldemort to kill
her instead, with Ron facing the spiders in CoS, with Snape facing
mortal peril every time he lies to Voldemort, and, especially, with
Harry in "The Forest Again" walking to meet his death at Voldemort's
hands.

In contrast, we see Dumbledore calmly planning his own death. We do
see the kind of courage I'm talking about when he forces himself to
drink the terrible potion in the cave, but the scene on the tower is
mostly Stoicism. "Severus, please!" reveals desperation, but it's not
fear for himself, it's fear that his plan, which has already gone
partially astray with Draco's Expelliarmus, will fail altogether. If
he were wholly stoic, perhaps he wouldn't have cared so much. He would
have accepted Voldemort's victory as inevitable, a burden that the WW
must stoically bear.

Please note that I'm thinking as I type and not presenting reasoned
arguments. I would say, though, that based on your post rather than
Kern's book, which I haven't read, that I tentatively disagree with
Kern's conclusions.

Carol, who thinks that Ravenclaw would be the focus of the books if
JKR were advocating Stoicism (Luna as Stoic, anyone?)