CHAPTER DISCUSSION PS/SS 10, THE HALLOWEEN LONG

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 188428

> > > Alla:
> > > 
> > > Tell me this. When you think about Gryffindor, would you call it a House of Peter Pettigrew?
> > 
> > Potioncat:
> > That's just it, I would. Gryffindor didn't only produce Dumbledore, James, Lily and Harry Potter. It produced Pettigrew.
> 
> Pippin:
> When I think of Gryffindor I think of the Trio's bravery, but I also think of Peter's treachery, Dumbledore's machinations, the Marauders' bullying, Maclaggan's oafishness and all the times when our heroes fell short of what we expected of them. 

Alla:

Well heroes falling short of what we expected of them to me has little to do with their bravery, unless by falling short you mean them acting cowardly of course.

But yes, this is seems to be one of the big irreconcilable difference between ours POVs. I however just want to clarify something before I let it go. I indeed do not think about Peter's treachery, or at least not right away when I think about Gryffindor, is not because I suffer memory loss. As far as I am concerned  it was a very deliberate choice on author's behalf to show a traitor from Gryffindor but make it a generation behind. I do not know how to explain it, but it is again sort of works on more subconscious level for me, I do not know.

It is a removed treachery, treachery which she chose not to repeat for Gryffindor, yes yes, I know we still see consequences of his treachery for Harry, for Sirius and so many others involved. And it is still not the same for me. I still do not **feel** as if Peter belongs to Gryffindor.

And I definitely do not think about Dumbledore's machinations when I think of him as Gryffindor, with him it is even murkier. Do we even KNOW 100% sure if he was in Gryffindor besides Hermione's words and the images of the door, etc?


Pippin:
> Certainly in CoS, Harry's choice of Gryffindor over Slytherin is made to symbolize Harry's superiority to Tom, but as the story unfolds  it no longer seems to me that Gryffindors are superior generally. I still have more positive associations with Gryffindor than I do with Slytherin, but if canon tells us anything, it is that such associations are not to be trusted no matter how compelling they seem.

Alla:

I do not feel that I have any other CHOICE but to trust those associations, simply because I do not see them contradicted much.


Pippin:
> If the average Gryffindor was supposed to be as brave and moral as Harry, then half of them would be as brave and moral as Harry is, or even more so. That clearly is not the case.

Alla:

I disagree, even with this being Harry's story, she made sure to show Ginny's bravery, Neville's bravery, Twins' bravery, etc. Based on this I think it is a safe assumption to make that Gryffindor is a House of Brave. IMO of course.

Pippin:
> Likewise if Tom or even Draco was the average Slytherin then half of Slytherin would be as bad as Tom or Draco,  or even worse. That doesn't seem to be the case either. 

Alla:

It is a case for me though, I am back to being unable to remember any average Slytherin students who are not as bad as Tom and Draco and as far as I am concerned  if she would have wanted to show them, she would have done so. IMO of course.

And yes, I know, Snape, Regulus and Slugghorn, they are brave, I do not dispute this, just does not make a case to me of average Slytherin student, not even close.

IMO,

Alla