CHAPTER DISCUSSION: PS/SS 4, The Keeper of the Keys

[potioncat]

No: HPFGUIDX 187854

Potioncat:
Thanks, Alla, for some great questions! I've slipped in a few bits from other posts on this thread.

>
> Alla:
1. "Suppose the mystery is why You-Know-Who never tried to get "em on his side before... probably knew they were too close ter Dumbledore ter want anythin' ter do with dark side" -p.55. Is this quote a case of Hagrid not being well informed or a case of JKR have not deciding that Voldemort tried to recruit Lily and James just yet?

Potioncat:
Hagrid isn't sure if LV intended to recruit the Potters, or went to kill them. IIRC, Lupin will tell a slightly different version. Given that DD never explains anything, I'd say this is the version as Hagrid understands it. What comes to my mind though, is whether Hagrid knew that Lily and James were in hiding at the time? If he did, what did he think was the reason? Or, is he just leaving that part out?



Alla: 
> She said it in the interview, but I cannot find the link, I am pretty positive though. I can accept this being a case of Hagrid misinformed, but I can also accept a second possibility, especially since she said it in the interviews. IMO of course.

Potioncat:
I recall a recruiting effort too, but I thought it was in canon. I'd like to add, that while JKR had her story planned out, surely there were some details that altered over the course or some bits that sprung up by surprise. Is that what you were getting at, Alla?


 >Alla:
2. As the way to convince Harry that he is truly a wizard, Hagrid reminds him about the things that had been happening around him when he is angry or upset.  We know that what Dursleys did upset Harry a great deal. Why haven't his accidental magic kicked in and harmed the Dursleys at least a little bit? 

>Alla (from a different post) (snipped)
> I am not sure that JKR thought about it, although I hope she did. I mean, to me Dursleys harmed Harry more than once and IMO if his magic was to act up, that would be first and foremost for his protection.  I suspect this was all for the plot, to make sure Harry will suffer, but I do  not find it awfully consistent. IMO of course.

Potioncat:
Do we know that accidental magic takes a dangerous turn? The incident with DD's sister seems to have been unusual. All of Harry's accidental magic has been defensive, except for blowing up Aunt Marge. Even that didn't "harm" her--and wasn't "blowing up" in the way we generally use the word "blowing up."  However, the type of accidental magic could depend on the type of person. Harry's not the sort to harm someone, unless you count the surprising result of the Cutting Curse in HBP. Perhaps Bellatrix's childhood accidental magic would have looked very different? 


Crouch!Moody said the DADA class wouldn't even be able to cause a nosebleed with the AK Curse. If the magic of somewhat trained wizards is limited, I would think the accidental magic would be too. So, again, I don't think it would be the norm that accidental magic would cause harm. Having said that, I think the WW thought that Harry's accidental magic did in LV.



> Alla:
> 3. In the beginning of this chapter Hagrid introduces himself as Keeper of Keys and Grounds at Hogwarts. At the end of the chapter he tells Harry that Dumbledore let him stay in Hogwarts as **gamekeeper**.  Is it a typo? Is it supposed to be **gatekeeper**?
If it is not a typo, could somebody explain to me how *keeper of the keys and grounds* is the same thing as *gamekeeper*? Thanks.

Potioncat:
Well, now that you mention it, groundskeeper and gamekeeper aren't generally the same thing. Can you imagine Hagrid planting flowers and decorative shrubs around the castle? Yet, I don't think it was a typo. I agree with an earlier post that this was a fancy title for Hagrid that sort of reflected his role on the grounds of Hogwarts. Just to make sure we're on the same wavelength, gamekeeper has to do with taking care of or managing animals. I think of it in terms of those animals on the estate that the lord of the manor would hunt. On the same token, it's Hagrid who provides the huge Christmas trees, so while he may not plant nice little flowerbeds, he must keep an eye on the woodland of the castle grounds. Oh, and he keeps the garden. 


>Alla:
4. In this chapter Hagrid tells Harry "real" version of his parents' death and Harry's encounter with Voldemort. In light of DH we of course know that this version at best can be called incomplete. Do you think that this "reader's digest" version that Hagrid delivers is what the majority of WW population knew about that night? Do you think this version is delivered only for Harry's benefit and Hagrid (and maybe some other people, I am not talking here about Dumbledore) knew at least some more details?

Potioncat:
Certainly the general WW does not know the whole story. Come to think of it, I don't think anyone else does either. I don't remember if DD told Snape that Lily actually sacrificed herself (as opposed to died defending Harry) So I think Hagrid is explaining the events as he understands them. Most of the WW believes that something special about Harry stopped DD. Some think Harry is or will be a Dark Wizard.


 
>Alla:
5. Do you believe Hagrid when he acts angry about Dursleys not telling Harry what was in that letter?

Potioncat:
Yes. The Dursleys have kept something important and special from him. Hagrid acts as if he knows what was in the letter. I think he's assuming. No one knows what DD actually told the Dursleys.



>Alla: 
6. Harry's invitation letter says that Hogwarts expects his owl no later than July 31. Do you think it was possible for Harry to refuse the invitation if he so desired?
> Alla from a later post:
> My question was more along the lines whether Dumbledore would allow him to do so
> and my answer is resounding No, no way, no how Dumbledore would let Harry slip out >of his steel grasp.

Potioncat:
Would DD have manipulated Harry into enrolling? Well, we'll never know. JKR wrote the story with the intent that Harry would be attracted to the magical world. I'm not sure if it's canon, or movie-contamination, but doesn't Harry say on several occasions, "I love magic."? I don't think JKR (or DD) ever considered that Harry might refuse. I can see DD allowing Harry to refuse and keeping watch on the situation.



> Alorkin:
> Why was Hagrid sent to collect Harry, instead of someone who actually knew what they were doing? Aren't there contact specialists? Hermione said Professor McGonagall came to her house personally.

Potioncat:
Is it canon that McGonagall visited Hermione? I don't remember it, do you know where that can be found? I think JKR said in an interview that a representative would go to a Muggle home to explain about magic and Hogwarts.

I don't know why DD sent Hagrid, probably for the same reason he sent him to retrieve Baby Harry. But I'm with McGonagall, "Hagrid! Do you think that's wise?"

We get a nice progression as the story unfolds. Hagrid carries Baby Harry from the ruins of the house to the Dursleys'. Hagrid takes Harry from the rock to the WW.  Hagrid carries Harry from the Dursleys during the 7 Potters. Hagrid carries Harry's "body" to the castle. He also carries DD's remains to the mausoleum.





> Janelle:
> Hagrid asks Harry not to mention the magic that he did at Hogwarts. Why isn't Harry at all suspicious of Hagrid? Why is he so quick to trust someone he just met who's already asking him to keep secrets?

Potioncat:
Oh boy, doesn't that go against everything we teach our kids? "Don't trust someone who asks you not to tell."  Again with the secrets in the series! But, you know--if I were Harry and I had suffered through 10 years of Dursleys and someone showed up and gave Dudley a pig-tail
.I'd be happy to keep the secret. 

Here's a question. Is there anyone in the HP series who does not keep secrets, or deal with secret keeping on some level?


Thanks again, Alla