[HPforGrownups] James as head boy (Re: Voldemort's Intentions & Snape's Expectations (Hagrid))

[Shaun Hately]

No: HPFGUIDX 189891

On 8/12/2010 3:39 AM, willsonteam wrote:
>
> However, JKR did not go to a boarding school and may not have known that
> James had to be a prefect in order to become Head Boy, or as someone
> already offered, JKR forgot she ever wrote that he was Head Boy.

JKR did not have to go to a boarding school to understand how these 
systems worked - they are quite common in day schools in Britain as 
well, not confined to boarding schools.

> Here's my question. Given Geoff's information, do you now consider Head
> Boy itself to be a flint and no longer relevant to the storythat is,
> James was not a Head Boy? Or do you consider it canon anyway, and James
> was a Head Boy. Does this change your perception of events?

I don't consider it a flint.

With all respect to Geoff, he knows what he is talking about - but so do 
I. I attended a school heavily based on the traditional British model 
(even if it was in Australia) and I was a Prefect. I also have 
considerable study of the history of such schools and their practices, 
and have even spent a fair amount of time trying to compare the 
practices at Hogwarts to the traditional practices of the schools it 
seems to be partly based on.

http://www.fictionalley.org/authors/shaun_hately/HSOWAWATBPS01.html

Now, a little dated - one day I will update it to incorporate details 
from the later novels. I think I know what I am talking about to.

It is true that in *most* schools based on this model, the Head Boy and 
Head Girl (where applicable) would be prefects. But it's also true that 
for almost every general rule as to how these schools work, there are 
occasional exceptions. Some schools do things a little differently from 
the norm. I see no real reason to assume that there is any rule at 
Hogwarts that says the Head Boy and Head Girl *must* have been prefects 
unless JKR tells us so.

Hogwarts model is already somewhat atypical - in most schools, prefects 
are appointed only from the final year students (although, as with other 
things, there are exceptions). This means, in general, that the Head Boy 
(or whatever title is used - I'm more used to Captain of the School, 
myself) is appointed at about the same time as the Prefects. Sometimes 
they are explicitly considered to be a Prefect as well, sometimes that's 
more an assumption than anything else. At Hogwarts, they are appointing 
Prefects from the last three years - and that's unusual.

The Head Boy and Head Girl are, presumably appointed by the Headmaster - 
and we don't know the criteria. Maybe there is a rule that says they 
must have been a Prefect - but we don't know that. Maybe the rule simply 
says the most outstanding students should be chosen - something that may 
have changed in the two years since the Fifth Year Prefects were 
appointed. We do have indications James changed in that time - I think 
indications he changed quite dramatically.

There's also the potential factor that what was wanted in a Head Boy or 
Head Girl may have changed somewhat during James and the others time at 
Hogwarts. We don't have exact dates on when and what Voldemort was doing 
- what we do seem to have is indication that during the 1970s he became 
progressively more powerful and progressively more feared - when 
Prefects were appointed in 1975, they may have been looking for good 
students who'd make good role models. When the Head Boy and Head Girl 
were appointed in 1977, they might have been looking for students who 
were able to help defend their fellows from actual danger. This is just 
speculation, but we're talking about a time of change in the Wizarding 
World where things were getting progressively more dangerous and darker.

Add into all of this, the additional comment we have on status from 
Hermione in Half Blood Prince.

""That gives you equal status with prefects!" cried Hermione happily.
"You can use our special bathroom now and everything!""

Hermione to me, seems to understand how the school works. I also think 
she understands and takes seriously what being a prefect means. When she 
describes the Quidditch Captain as being of equal status to a Prefect, 
and expressly says he as has "everything" a Prefect has, I think that's 
pretty telling.

To further back this up, I'd like to share two other quotes - one from 
Philosopher's Stone/Sorcerer's Stone:

"I'm the sixth in our family to go to Hogwarts. You could say I've got a 
lot to live up to. Bill and Charlie have already left - Bill was head 
boy and Charlie was captain of Quidditch. Now Percy's a prefect."

Not - Charlie is not described as a Prefect, but as Captain of Quidditch.

Now - from Order of the Phoenix:

"'I don't believe it! I don't believe it! Oh, Ron, how wonderful! A 
prefect! That's everyone in the family!'"

Mrs Weasley's quote - now admittedly, I think this would have more 
evidentiary value if she hadn't apparently forgotten about Fred and 
George. But I also that Fred and George don't raise Charlie as a further 
objection to her statement. I think there's real reason to suppose the 
Quidditch Captain is a prefect - so even if only prefects can be made 
Head Boy or Head Girl, James could come up through that path.