Finished - lots of spoilers...

[carolynwhite2]

--- In the_old_crowd at yahoogroups.com, "bluesqueak" <pip at ...> wrote:
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> --- In the_old_crowd at yahoogroups.com, "carolynwhite2" 
> <carolynwhite2@> wrote:
> <snip>
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Jo:
>Oh Carolyn how I laughed, thank you for that!
>Anne:
>Yes, me too!
Pip!Squeak
>I liked your breakdown of the plot. Start the day giggling, that's 
what I say.

Carolyn:
Ladies, I'm flattered, but alas it's one of those cases of if you 
don't laugh, you'd have to cry!
(Speaking of which, erm, has anyone seen Pippin? We all have to be 
VERY understanding, right? Up until the point where Harry sent Lupin 
packing back to his nymphomaniac, I really thought ESE!Lupin might 
come off after all.. he was definitely very shifty.)

Pip!Squeak:
But I don't think she ever lost the over-arch. From memory, Book
1 is the Philosopher's *stone* giving eternal life plus a mirror that
means Harry can see the dead - and the DH ring contains a stone,
bringing back the dead. It also has DH 2 inherited by Harry. Book 2
contains a horcrux as its major plot. Book 3 makes much play of the
invisibility cloak (DH2). Book 4 is titled *goblet* of fire - another
ref to the horcrux's, and also makes much play of wands (another DH).
Book 5 contains another horcrux, which no one recognises. In Book 6,
while we don't realise this, DD's doom is brought about by his 
reaching
for a DH, AND the horcrux, and Draco finds himself official owner of
another DH. In fact, aren't all three together on the Tower? Book 7
brings both plot arcs together.

Jo:
Hated the deathstick, simply a WTF moment for me. The whole
wand/owner/defeater thing became somewhat farcical, I couldn't help
but recall Danny Kaye and *the pellet with the poison is in the
flagon with the dragon.*

Carolyn:
Certainly the whole series has been about whether or not you can, or 
should want to escape death. I read the quotes at the front of DH 
with relish and found the first half of the book very promising – I 
really thought she would give us a grown up outcome, but sadly it 
didn't transpire. She's said that the end has been written since she 
started, by which I suppose she means that awful epilogue. I think 
that turned into a real hostage to fortune, because it prevented her 
killing off any of the trio. I was reminded of that time Harry had to 
do a stupid twiddle in mid-air to avoid being hit by a bludger; I 
felt JKR had to do the same – first with Hagrid, who should have been 
deaded no question (what on earth stopped Voldie?), and then Harry.

Agree with Pip!Squeak's identification of hoxboxes by chapter, but 
still think she cheated by not indicating anywhere that there was 
another legend (the DH) which some but not all of them played into. 
The only hints I can think of were DD's interest in alchemy (never 
satisfactorily explained), his insistence on Harry always getting the 
cloak back and Ollivander's fascination with what could really be 
done with a wand by the right wizard, whether for good or evil. 
Although we got a lot of retrospective hints about places where 
Voldie could have stashed bits of his soul, I really don't think 
anyone could have predicted the DH dimension. So, can't see how she 
can bring together a plot arc for us that only she knows about.

Jo:
Ye gods what were all those hints about, the late flowering magic,
Lily and James' jobs, the married teacher


Carolyn:
OK, who is going to start the Official List of queries and 
inconsistencies? Here's some more in no particular order as they 
occur to me:

-	She cannot be SERIOUS that Snape's patronus is a 
DOE?? ::boggle::

-	Who was kissing Florence behind the greenhouses?

-	Why on earth would Rowena Ravenclaw's tiara be hidden in a 
tree in Albania? Talk about desperate plotting, more reminiscent of a 
chapter from Gadding with Ghouls

-	How did Voldie get his wand back in GOF? Still not explained.

-	Why did Peter hide in Hagrid's hut? What was he waiting for?

-	Why didn't DD get Sirius out of Azkaban?

-	Harry's glasses/Lily's eyes? What was all that about?

-	Who showed magic late in life?

-	When did Bellatrix acquire Helga's cup? How come Voldie 
couldn't read her mind that she'd nicked it?

-	Why didn't Voldie feel it when his soul-bits were destroyed 
one by one? And how come it took him so long to get there and back to 
the cave? He can Apparate can't he? And his own enchantments wouldn't 
prevent him..

-	Who owns Gryffindor's sword if the Hat keeps producing it for 
those that show loyalty? Do Founder's Hats trump Goblin rights? [NB 
many artists feel that buyers of artworks only have them on loan and 
that they have a right to have them back and change them if they want 
to; does JKR feel this about her books..?]

-	Who was the Half-blood Prince then? Definitely Snape? And it 
was Lily's writing in his book? 

-	Do we believe that Lily and Petunia grew up in the same 
neighbourhood as Snape? (acknowledgement Kneasy). So, what did happen 
to the girls' parents, and for that matter the Potter parents?

-	Snape was supposed to come to school an expert in the Dark 
arts – didn't look like it from the pensieve memories

-	What happened to the withered hand that lights the way for 
thieves?

-	Prof Trelawny used magic with enthusiasm in the final battle, 
so she is not a squib. So why did she wander the corridors looking 
for places to hide sherry bottles and not just vanish them? Why does 
ANY wizard try to hide things in the Room of Requirement, and surely 
each time anyone goes in there to do that, by definition they see a 
whole lot of things that other people would prefer not to be seen..

-	What was DD doing waiting for Harry in limbo? He's been dead 
a while now and Nick told us that wizards need to make a pretty 
prompt decision to move on when they die.
 
-	So, what was all that about the courtroom, the Veil and the 
locked room at the MoM? Is no one ever going to tell us what they 
were researching? Surely Voldie investigated all that the moment he 
got in there????

-	And what message was Neville's mother trying to give him? AND 
WHAT ABOUT TREVOR?

We need to be told

..

Carolyn