[HPforGrownups] Re: An Elfly Reminder

[Ceridwen]

Random832:
> The problem is not that I got called out for supposedly "insulting"
you. The problem is that I am _absolutely_ sure that if i'd instead
called you a "smart-aleck" (which means the exact same thing) none of 
this would happened. The presence of a four-letter (ok, three-letter) 
word jumped out at someone, and he/she felt the need to react, 
despite the lack of a rule against the word "ass". Remember, the elf 
responding was surprised at the use of the term itself, not at any 
perceived insult to you or anyone else.

Vexxy/Ceridwen:
As the elf HERself (I get that all the time, btw, it's the uncommon 
name. I'm female, for future reference) I can answer what I thought.  
You called Steve a "smart-ass".  I was surprised.  And, almost as 
shocked as if you had called him a "jerk" or a "fool".  Those two 
words are almost never, in my experience, used in an endearing way, 
while "smart-ass" has been.  Since you did not put any smilies or 
other notations of teasing, such as *g* or (jk, pal), it seemed that 
you meant it in a derogatory manner.

As others have mentioned, if you had called a character a smart-ass, 
jerk, fool, woefully inadequate, moron, etc., or said that a 
character was one of those things, and supported your claim ("Madam 
Hooch was a fool to have left first-years alone with brooms" for an 
instance), then there would be no problem.  I cuss very well, thank 
you, "smart-ass" is nothing to me.  What surprised me, and what is 
against policy, is calling a fellow list-member a "smart-ass" or any 
sort of derogatory name.

Random (I presume):
> I don't want to "gain from experience" that this is a list where 
not a
> single "four-letter word" is permitted. Because it's not. And if it
> is, they should say so, and they _should_ rename it HPforKids.

Vexxy/Ceridwen:
Try reading past posts.  People use curse/swear/cusswords.  What most 
people don't do is insult other posters.

Random832:
> Well - part of the issue is that I was called out publically - Even
> though it was an accident, I did feel like I had to defend myself.

Vexxy/Ceridwen:
And I apologized for that, publicly, as it was sent publicly.

Random:
> Speaking of which - while I do see the need for these rules (and I 
was
> willing to go along with it even before I understood it), I wish you
> guys would give it a rest sometimes. I'm trying. I don't need to 
have
> every single little mistake pointed out. It's very hard to get used 
to
> doing and it would be nice to get a little credit for the progress i
> _have_ made.

Vexxy/Ceridwen:
When should we "give it a rest"?  When it is your post that is 
insulting to another member?  Or when another member insults you?  
The way you reacted to a "friendly reminder" accidentally being sent 
to the list makes me wonder how you would react to someone calling 
you a "smart-ass" publicly in discussion.  If someone should call you 
a name, whatever name it might happen to be, the elves would off-list 
that person about it just as surely as you were contacted.  Maybe not 
as publicly, the other elves *do* have more command of the Yahoo! 
mail features than I do!  Oh, and I really am sorry for that, I 
certainly wouldn't want a reminder meant for only me to be 
accidentally sent to the board.

>From what I understand, when an elf has to remind someone about 
something that has been mentioned before, and they are aware that the 
person has been doing better regarding that thing, they do mention 
the positive history in their reminder.  I don't recall anyone ever 
saying that Random used to call people names and has done very well 
lately, so I didn't mention it.  As far as I know, this was the first 
time you have ever called someone a name.  But as I mentioned in my 
reminder, some people might not take kindly to it.  We need to be on 
top of things to prevent hurt feelings and facilitate a friendly 
environment on the list.

And, I don't mean only Steve taking it wrong.  Other people read the 
public exchanges.  And, other people might get defensive on Steve's 
behalf, or simply take the fact of the name-calling as a personal 
affront.  All of our members deserve respect for their feelings as 
much as we can manage it.

Ceridwen, for Vexxy Elf.