[HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: "You're Just Selfish!" (WAS moved from Main List: on not having children)

[Shaun Hately]

On 2 Sep 2003 at 10:50, pengolodh_sc wrote:

> I think Kari was referring to single mothers who themselves are 
> enlisted in the armed forces.  And I think Rita is right - these wll 
> be cases of single mothers being left with the armed forces as the one 
> job-possibility where they get a decent outcome (and even a decent 
> insurance-plan so that there is something left for the child, should 
> something happen), and also get help to get into college afterwards.  
> Then it is a calculated risk - "will USA get into a war while I am 
> enlisted, and will my unit be called up to take part in such a 
> conflict".  I am wondering if also some of those military mothers have 
> been part of the reserve-forces, which have been called up for the 
> recent conflict.

I'm the son of Australian sailors - my father was a Chief Petty Officer 
who served 20 years (career man). My mother was a Petty Officer who 
served around 6 or 7 - and was planning a career.

When they married, my mother outranked my father, and the jobs she was 
doing were much more valuable than is (in the sense that far fewer 
people could do what she did - I don't actually know what it was, 
because it's classified (heh - I have the clearance that I can probably 
find out now. Dad was a gunner - and a good one, he finished up as one 
of the Navy's senior gunnery instructors - but more replacable when she 
was).

It's hard to estimate a Naval career so we can't be sure what Mum would 
have accomplished - but my Godmother who served parallel to Mum did 
close to 30 years and wound up at the highest NCO rank (her service was 
significant enough that she was actually invited to participate in the 
Olympic Torch relay for her services to the community). Mum could have 
done that - maybe, it's not possible to be certain. What is certain is 
she had a long career ahead of her.

At the time (early-mid 1970s) women served under considerably different 
rules from men - one of those rules among many, was that they couldn't 
serve in combat (at least not intentionally - they could not be posted 
to any combat-likely assignment).

Indeed when Mum fell pregnant with me (after a doctor told her she was 
infertile, and had no need for birth control - gee, I'm glad he was 
wrong), she had to leave the service. Her career was over.

Growing up in the Navy (Dad was still in - as was my Godmother), the 
issue of women's service was therefore significant. And the fact was 
that being denied access to the same jobs as men, meant women had less 
opportunity to achieve promotion, and success in their careers. And, 
really, that's not surprising - if you're not allowed to do the same 
job, you can't get the same experiences you need to achieve high rank.

My Godmother did - because as she served, more and more opportunities 
opened up, and that gave her the increased opportunities she needed for 
promotion. But she was a mother (she waited quite a while to become one, 
because she had to wait for it to be possible and for her to keep her 
career) and her husband (who was also a sailor) gave up his career to 
raise the children (mainly because at the time this happened, he felt 
he'd reached his peak, while she still had a way to go - so they 
sacrificed the less important career).

I lost my father when I was 15, as a result of his war service (he 
didn't die in a war - but his health was ruined by one, and he lost 
thirty years of expected life). Honestly, I don't think I'd have been 
any more hurt if it had been my mother who died. Losing a parent is 
losing a parent in my experience. I don't see that there's that much 
difference. I appreciate it's not that way for everyone - but I'd find 
it bloody hard to choose.

All this, long winded rambling (I have a fever, so I hope it makes 
sense!) - basically, women in the military here (and I believe 
elsewhere) have fought a long battle towards equality - and when it 
comes to equality, for it to mean anything, it has to mean equality in 
all areas, not just some. And there's a lot of them who think the price 
- and the commensurate risks - were worth it.

And remember - war isn't the only risk. Danger is part of any military 
life. This is equality. I have the quote because I knew Meagan,  
referred to in the following - not well, but I knew her a little.

"On Tuesday, 5 May, a dreadful fire broke out in the engine room of the 
HMAS Westralia as she was testing compasses 20 or so kilometres off the 
coast of Western Australia. In that dreadful disaster four gallant 
sailors were killed. They were Midshipman Meagan Kelly, 22, from 
Queensland; Petty Officer Shaun Smith, 29, from Western Australia; 
Leading Seaman Bradley Meek, 25, from New South Wales; and Able Seaman 
Phillip Carroll, 23, from Victoria. The commanding officer of the HMAS 
Westralia, Commander Dietrich, had no option but to close the water- and 
gas-tight doors of the engine room soon after the inferno broke out. On 
his order the carbon dioxide drench was activated, immediately starving 
the space of oxygen. The drench failed to extinguish the blaze, as the 
ship drifted off the Western Australian coast."

Now, I realise that people aren't just talking about female 
servicepeople - but about single mothers, and mothers, in general. And I 
think single parents may be a special case - but I don't believe mothers 
should be. They have to make the choice.

But my dad was at sea on and off, for half of my life until I was 7. He 
came under fire (his war service was before I was born, but he did 
fishery patrols, and went after pirates at times). He went overboard at 
least once, and could have been killed very easily.

I could have lost a father then, rather than 8 years later. But 
honestly, it's not a father I would have lost - it's a parent. And, god, 
I couldn't choose between the two.

I know some people feel a mother's more important to a child than a 
father - and I respect that for them. But it wasn't for me - and that 
means this isn't any type of easy choice.


Yours Without Wax, Dreadnought
Shaun Hately | www.alphalink.com.au/~drednort/thelab.html
(ISTJ)       | drednort at alphalink.com.au | ICQ: 6898200 
"You know the very powerful and the very stupid have one
thing in common. They don't alter their views to fit the 
facts. They alter the facts to fit the views. Which can be 
uncomfortable if you happen to be one of the facts that 
need altering." The Doctor - Doctor Who: The Face of Evil
Where am I: Frankston, Victoria, Australia