Bonfire Night/Godparents (some comments)

[Neil Ward]

No: HPFGUIDX 17303

BONFIRE NIGHT

Catlady described Bonfire Night, Guy Fawkes and the Gunpowder Plot

<snip wonderfully detailed description>

<<<This particular effigy is called 'the guy'. For days before the 5th, boys
carry the guy with them and go around begging for money (which they
supposedly will use to buy fireworks Bonfire Night) by saying 'Penny for the
guy?'.>>>

Although 'Penny for the guy' is much less common in the UK these days, I
wouldn't say it is exclusively boys who do this.  Also, it's not usual for
them to go door-to-door as in trick-or-treating; they will usually sit on
the pavement outside their house or some local shops, displaying an outmoded
Mutant Ninja Turtles mask atop Dad's nearly new suit, stuffed with Mum's
precious heirloom cushions.  Only when the flames are licking at the Guy
during the Bonfire Night party, do the parents realise, with horror, that
the kids have been through the cupboards again...

<<<It is remarkable how many old English  traditions involve going around
from house to house begging for money or a drink of alcohol. In USA, we just
have Halloween begging for candy (trick-or-treating).>>>

Hmmmm.  I can't imagine what you mean.  The only tradition I can think of is
Carol Singing at Christmas, when the singers may be collecting for charity.
Some may dole out hot toddies, but I usually just peer at them through the
letterbox and shout "Bah, Humbug!".  If you could care to expand on your
observation on OT Chatter (or to me, privately), I'm intrigued.

<<<I have never been in UK and don't know if they still sing their
traditional begging song:>>>

Unless I'm mistaken, that isn't a begging song; it's just a rhyme associated
with the Gunpowder Plot.

GODPARENTS

I know this is also a bit OT, but it clings to its on-topicality, because
Penny had asked about the meaning of godfather in relation to Sirius Black.

I agree with everything Catherine said about godparents, and, in the Church
of England, at least, it is a tradition for boys to have two godfathers and
one godmother and for girls to have two godmothers and one godfather (it's
not just your family, Catherine!).  Although the origins of godparenthood
are religious, it is often used simply as a means to honour some close
friends or siblings of the parents and they may then do little more than
give the child gifts on significant dates.  The religious aspect is, as
Catherine said, that the godparents are seen as religious or spiritual
guides for the child.  At the Christening (baptism), they are expected to
step forward and speak on the child's behalf.  I think many people just ask
their chosen godparents and don't go near a church.  I was baptised and I
have a very devoutly Christian godmother and two atheists (one late) as
godfathers, none of whom has ever offered me guidance.  However, a medium
once told me that I am possessed by my deceased godfather (who is also my
uncle), but I digress....

As to Penny's question, I think a godparent could be seen a proxy guardian,
but grandparents, aunts and uncles (The Dursleys - gaaaah!!!) would probably
be considered first, and there is no legal bond (unless specified).  To me a
godparent seems a bizarre thing to have in a world based in witchcraft, but
on second thoughts, JKR has not so much embraced Wiccan or Pagan beliefs, as
created a word of Magic intermingled with many comforting Muggle traditions,
such as the rather secular Christmas celebrations.

It's my view that JKR is portraying Sirius as an alternative guardian, not
someone the Potters chose to be a religious guide.  That said, I'd love to
know if James and Lily appointed another godfather and a godmother to Harry;
not everyone follows that three-godparents tradition, but they usually have
at least one of each sex.  I wonder who might be Harry's fairy godmother?
In spirit, at least, it has to be Molly Weasley.

Neil
________________________________________

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"The cat's ginger fur was thick and fluffy, but it was definitely
a bit bow-legged and its face looked grumpy and oddly
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