[HPforGrownups] Re: Ron/Sirius parallels

[Monika Huebner]

No: HPFGUIDX 11368

On Wed, 31 Jan 2001 08:45:49 -0600, Penny & Bryce Linsenmayer
<pennylin at swbell.net> wrote:

>We still don't know the full story on the werewolf prank pulled by
>Sirius, and so I reserve judgment against Sirius in that matter until
>the story is more fully fleshed out.  I am in no way a Snape fan though,
>so that colors my perception.  I much more readily give the benefit of
>the doubt to Sirius (and Dumbledore -- who knew the whole story & did
>not expell Sirius).  I distrust Snape, so I'm disinclined to give any
>credence to his version of events.

Thanks Penny for pointing this out. I am always amazed about the fact
that a lot of people see Snape as an innocent victim of this practical
joke. Like you I cannot believe that Dumbledore would have reacted in
the way he did if Snape was all innocent. Of course he wanted to
protect Lupin, and maybe that was one of the reasons of why he kept it
quiet. But Sirius was also one of his most promising students, so he
might not have wanted to expel him and destroy his future. But I also
dislike and distrust Snape, so I'm more inclined to put part of the
blame on him.

>>Kimberley said: In PoA he was in attack/revenge/protection mode, which was quite
>> anger-oriented,
>
>Penny said: I agree with Monika & Carole that his actions appear to be less
>motivated by *anger* as they are by PTSD, stress, etc.

Anger, aggression and violence is one of the core problems of PTSD,
it's a classic symptom in male victims. That's why men with PTSD often
get stigmatized, they are considered to be violent jerks, but the
truth is that they can't control it because it is a physiological
reaction. And after a while, they don't even need a trigger that is
directly related to the original traumatic event, they build up a kind
of trigger network that will contain elements which have nothing to do
with the original trauma. Sirius is in constant attack mode in PoA,
but if you look at it more closely, it shouldn't really surprise you
why this is.

>>Kimberly said: You have to take into account the fact that his first instinct, as a
>> kid in the MWPP days, as a young adult when James and Lily died, and
>> in the events of PoA, was to seek vengeance.

The need to seek vengeance is also a classic PTSD symptom. This is why
I think he had ASD (Acute Stress Disorder) when he went after
Pettigrew. The symptoms are the same as for PTSD, but the onset is
immediate and not delayed. Think about it: his whole world had just
been shattered, his best friends had been murdered and he thought he
was responsible for it. Here we have a classic PTSD case with the need
for vengeance and overwhelming survivor guilt.

>Penny said: As a teenager in the MWPP days -- we don't know yet *what* motivated him
>to play that prank.  I'm not sure it's fair to say it was vengeance when
>we really don't know much about it other than it occurred & that
>Dumbledore knew about it (chose not to take action) and that Snape is
>still incredibly bitter about it.

I also had the impression that Sirius took it for a schoolboy prank
but Snape still was incredibly bitter about it. After about twenty
years. Is that normal? I don't think so. Maybe there is still
something more about the roots of their hatred which we still don't
know.

>As a young adult when James & Lily died - he might not have been seeking
>vengeance per se as much as he hoped to trap Peter, turn him into the
>authorities & clear his own name.  He was outwitted by Peter -- and as
>suggested by others yesterday, I would wager this was due to his stress
>level & shock.  He did go looking for Peter, but who's to say his intent
>all along wasn't simply to bind him up & turn him into the authorities
>so that his own name could be cleared?

Hmm, I don't know. If he really had Acute Stress Disorder (and I'm
pretty convinced that was the case) he would actually have been
seeking vengeance. That's the "disorder" part in the name of the
syndrome. But he couldn't control it, it was purely instinctive and
that's why I think he wasn't responsible for doing it. It would also
support the PTSD theory: since he didn't get help immediately after
the events, his symptoms would have persisted and developed into
full-blown PTSD.

>Penny said: I couldn't agree more!  I had thought it was very weird that Harry and
>Ron had never had a fight up until GoF.

I have to agree here, too. That was really weird. I think that boys
that age would fight - if not all the time - but quite often, although
they are friends. So their fight in GoF was long overdue.

>Penny said: My main problem with Ron in the fight in GoF is this: I think Hermione
>immediately saw from the expression on Harry's face that he hadn't
>entered his name.  I can't help wondering *what* Ron was thinking -- it
>strikes me that he just wasn't all that perceptive. 

I think Ron just isn't mature enough to overcome his jealousy. Girls
of 14 or 15 are generally a lot more mature than boys of the same age.
I didn't like this aspect of Ron either, but I tend to attribute it to
his immaturity.

Monika


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