[HPforGrownups] Loving multiple characters exclusionary? Hagrid and Snape

[porphyria at mindspring.com]

No: HPFGUIDX 37599

Naama signed off: 

<<
Naama, wondering whether you can only love Hagrid *or* Snape, but not both
>>

Better late than never (I hope), here's my contribution to this thread.

Kimberly, I loved your reply today. You point out so many parallels and things that Snape and Hagrid have in common which are many of the reasons I like them both. In fact you could argue that degree of 'niceness' and 'intellect vs. emotions' is about all that separates them. Well -- maybe not all. :-) But I definitely see them as both likeable, and I'm going to argue that you can like them for similar reasons. 

Let me start by summing up why I like Snape as a character, and then I'll relate those points to Hagrid. I'll try to be concise about Snape since I've said a lot of stuff before, and given that he's this week's discussion topic, I'll probably say it all again. 

One of the things that really intrigues me in a character (and wins my sympathy) is what kind of problem or struggle they bring to the story. (I go on at great length in post #34740.) I like to see how a character struggles with the problems they've got, or how they resolve the tension they create in the story. I'm more interested in this than in how pleasant their personality is or how much I'd like to be friends with them in real life. I'd rather see a character be guilt-ridden than nice, since guilt is a sign of internal struggle. 

Now, while Snape's motivation is still unclear, it certainly seems like the point of his character is redemption for past crimes, and in his case it is a huge struggle to redeem himself since he has such an irascible personality (and a lot of distrust) working against him. His own sadistic instincts might even be working against him, but on the other hand there's evidence that he suffers from guilt and regret, and that he has some protective instincts mitigating his cruel ones. So he's very much at odds with himself. And we do see him struggle for redemption, often while being misunderstood, when he tries to protect Harry, serve Dumbledore both as a headmaster and a spymaster, and generally carry out his duties. The fact that he often does it badly, the fact that he misjudges at the end of PoA or that he misreads Harry and that he probably goes about things the wrong way sometimes make it more emotionally involving for me, because it's not easy for him and he does still try to!
 do the right thing in his own way. 

OK, so about Hagrid. Hagrid has a set of struggles of his own. He's got lots of little ones, some of them not quite as obvious as Snape's, but they're still intriguing. When Hagrid is just a gentle giant I find him more ho-hum, but when he's got a problem to work out, then I find him endearing.

One of the things Hagrid struggles with is his teaching. (Granted, this is not an issue Snape seems to lose sleep over!) I sympathize with him so deeply because teaching is hard, especially if you want to make all your students happy all the time and still force them to learn things. It's not intuitive for Hagrid at all. His choice of hippogriffs for his first class was a tragic miscalculation, not just because of the Draco factor, but because a dangerous animal is not the best choice for a first class full of active teenagers -- one of them was liable to get injured one way or another. But he wanted to start the class off with something that might fascinate them as much as it fascinates him. One of my favorite Hagrid moments is when he's consoling Ron for Hermione's defense of Crookshanks and he remarks "Ah, well, people can be a bit stupid abou' their pets," just as Buckbeak spits out a pile of bloody ferret bones on his bed. Hagrid knows he loves dangerous animals to a bit !
of a fault, but he can't quite help himself. So he overcompensates in his class by replacing the hippogriffs with the flobberworms, which bore everyone silly, and he still hasn't gotten the knack with the Skrewts. By now my heart is breaking for him. But lest we relegate him to the heap of lame Hogwarts professors, he finally starts getting his act together after the Skeeter nightmare at the end of GoF with the nifflers. Everybody loves nifflers. So he's still trying to be a good teacher, and maybe he's getting better at it after all. 

Another one of my favorite Hagrid issues is how he deals with his alcohol problem. I know I shouldn't think alcoholism is cute and cuddly, but, well, it's only fiction and it is moving in his case. In PS/SS when Hagrid takes Harry to Diagon alley, he makes a point of refusing a drink at the pub since he's been forbidden to drink while on Hogwarts duty. But after his wild ride at Gringotts he just can't take it; he drops Harry off at Ollivander's and shows up a little while later in better...spirits. And when something devastates Hagrid he gives himself over entirely to the comfort of the bottle until he gets a grip on himself. So he has to struggle against the part of his personality that is telling him to drown his troubles; he has to force himself to act against his own instincts. You can also cite his weakness for using magic when he's forbidden and his violence as examples of bad habits in a crisis. One could compare these weaknesses to Snape's habit of falling on his wors!
t qualities of rage and stubbornness when he's in a crisis; we would hope that both characters get a little better at handling themselves as the series progresses.

As Kimberly pointed out, both Hagrid and Snape must deal with mistrust and prejudice. Hagrid can't help being a half-giant (as opposed to Snape is who is responsible for having been a DE), but he suffers from it like Snape (I too see them both as depressive types) and he's not above a little sense of shame, which again he struggles to fend off. And he has to deal with the consequences of his heritage: a broken home (giantesses apparently aren't very maternal) and his violent tendencies, which I assume to be a 'giant' thing. When Hagrid speaks of Dumbledore's support after the Skeeter article, he says of him:

<quote>
"Got me the gamekeeper job...trusts people, he does. Gives 'em second chances ... tha's what sets him apar' from other heads, see. He'll accept anyone at Hogwarts, s'long as they've got the talent. Knows people can turn out okay even if their families weren'...well...all tha' respectable."
</quote>

I believe this applies equally to Snape as it does to Hagrid, and I think it's possible that Hagrid even realizes this. Snape is probably from as disreputable as background as Hagrid is and he's even more in need of a second chance than Hagrid (who is only perceived to be near-criminal). But Hagrid identifies with this position and sees himself, like Snape, as a character who has to rely on Dumbledore to get his life organized again, to recuperate from bad experiences, and to redeem himself to himself, to live a life he's going to be prouder of. And, like Snape, he will, and very courageously. 

Aaah! What's not to love about both of them! I hope I've answered Naama's original query. :-)

~~Porphyria