The Big Bangers and Neville

[cindysphynx]

No: HPFGUIDX 35720

Elkins wrote:

> The *last* time we tried to discuss Neville, I seem
> to remember that you gave me my ring back.  And all of the love 
> letters.  *And* you mocked my SYCOPHANTS badge.

I thought we decided we could still be friends.  Besides, I see that 
you have rebounded to George, and deep down I'm very happy for you.  
Really, I am.  I'll just have to remember what we had.  Or at least, 
what I *thought* we had. 

Elkins wrote (about the best way to have Neville's backstory be Big):

> We *want* him traumatized.
> We want poor little toddler Neville, huddling in the closet while
> the Evil Death Eeaters horribly torture Mum and Dad.  And do you 
> know *why* we want it that way?
> 
> Because it's a Very Big Bang.  *That's* why.
> 

Oh, you want to play "My Neville Backstory Is Bigger Than Yours," 
huh?  OK, I'm in. 

I sense a serious misunderstanding about exactly how Big the Reverse 
Memory Charm can be.  Neville as a small toddler who later gets a 
Reverse Memory Charm is Big.  Heck, it's *Huge*.  Let me set the 
scene.

Neville is very young when the attacks happen.  Mrs. Lestrange 
bursts through the door and overpowers the Longbottoms.  Neville is 
cowering in the corner. Anyone who has a toddler knows they are very 
good at cowering.  They cower at the slightest provocation, in 
fact.  So you can certainly have the drama of toddler Neville 
cowering in the corner, flinching, sucking his thumb, whatever you 
want. 

Moody arrives to find his good friend Frank a broken shell of a 
man.  The same Frank who saved Moody's life in the ambush.  Moody is 
broken up over this, and he soon realizes there are no witnesses and 
no clues.  Crouch Sr. arrives and is so hell-bent on catching dark 
wizards for his own political advancement that he demands the 
Reverse Memory Charm on Neville.  Crouch Sr. is so heartless that he 
orders the Reverse Memory Charm even though it will damage Neville's 
memory *and* cause him to remember the torture vividly, which he 
otherwise wouldn't remember.  Crouch Sr. isn't interested in 
traditional Auror investigation techniques; he doesn't have time for 
that.  He needs a Big arrest right now.

Moody is torn.  His Big Bad Auror self wants to use the boy to make 
a big arrest and avenge Frank.  But Moody also knows Frank would 
never want Neville harmed to avenge him.  Besides, if they hold off, 
maybe they can catch the bad guys some other way, without harming 
Neville.  Ah, savor the internal conflict.  That scene has all sorts 
of heavy implications about Crouch's abuse of power (and Moody's gut-
wrenching internal conflict) and is mighty Big.  Moody goes along 
and puts the Reverse Memory Charm on Neville and Neville identifies 
the Lestranges.

Elkins wrote:

>What is all this wishy-washy "oh, let's keep him only
> an infant, because that way he could never have really been 
> traumatized much anyway" nonsense?  What is all this "Oh, we can't 
> give the poor kid a suppressed traumatic memory -- that's just so 
> ugly, it's all so *crooo-el* -- so let's just make it a Reverse 
> Memory Charm instead" tripe?

Whaaaat?  No, no, no.  The Reverse Memory Charm doesn't spare 
Neville pain.  It is the Memory Charm people who are giving Neville 
this handy Memory Charm so he won't have to think about what 
happened when he was a young child.  Oh, isn't that just so nice and 
merciful and sweet -- Neville is feeling blue and we made it all 
better and fixed Neville's boo-boo with a Memory Charm.  

No, no, no.  Reverse Memory Charm Neville suffers, you see.  I'm 
giving Neville a *tremendous* amount of pain.  I'm enhancing his 
memory so that he hears the shrieks of his parents *every darn 
day*.  Not only has the Reverse Memory Charm wrecked his memory for 
things like where he left his toad, it has caused him to repeatedly 
experience his parents' torture in Dolby and Technocolor.  Reverse 
Memory Charm Neville has to be Tough to avoid losing his mind 
completely, if you ask me.  

I like to be inclusive, though.  If you like, Neville can be a 
SYCOPHANT in the making.  Add the pressure of ToadKeeper where 
Neville has to be strong enough to restore his parents, and you have 
cinematic nitroglycerin.

Elkins again:

> Look, Neville at the Court Hearing is a *Dud,* okay?  You know it, 
I 
> know it. Everyone knows it.  It lacks drama.  It lacks pizzazz.  
It 
> lacks oomph.  It lacks any sturm-und-drang at all, frankly.  An 
> infant gurgles his way merrily through a scene of unspeakable 
> atrocity, but is later enchanted to be able to point one pudgy 
finger 
> at the Lestranges and blurt "Gah?"

OK, I have to admit that there would *not* be a scene in which 
chubby-faced Neville starts speaking with Darth Vadar's voice and 
gives an interview with Moody.  You know, the kind of scene where 
the kid's mouth never matches up with the adult dialogue.  That 
scene is all off-camera; Moody tells us about it.  

And don't forget about wizarding justice.  There *is* no big trial 
scene in the wizarding world because they seem to have no use for 
proper trials.  Neville doesn't convict the Lestranges; he just 
identifies them so Moody can track them down.

Besides, with Reverse Memory Charm Neville, I get something *Bigger* 
than a garden-variety trial scene.  I get Moody, on the strength of 
Neville's identification, hunting down the Lestranges like dogs in 
the street, trying to bring them in single-handedly to avenge Frank, 
only to get his leg and eye handed to him.  I get a future scene in 
which Neville breaks down and tells the whole story.  I also get 
*Big* Box Office.

Compare that with Memory Charm Neville, who is 3 and still can't 
finger the Lestranges without some magical assistance.  How do the 
Lestranges get caught if not by Reverse Memory Charm Neville?  
Hmmm?  Hmmm?  Is our Big scene when Gran comes in, sees Neville's 
tear-stained face, and gives him a magical memory-ectomy?  

Elkins again:

>You want huddling-in-the-closet-whimpering-pitifully-with-
> his-eyes-squeezed-tightly-shut-while-rocking-back-and-forth-
> autistically Neville.  <snip>  And besides all of that, it 
> also gives you the opportunity to remove that Memory Charm later 
on 
> and get the even Bigger and even Bangier Flashback Neville.

To tell you the truth, I want nothing to do with Memory Charm 
Neville.  If this is oh-so-painful that Neville needed a Memory 
Charm, then why are we removing it?  And if Neville has a Memory 
Charm, I have to throw popcorn at the screen for each of his visits 
to his parents.  "Gran, why are you taking me to see these *perfect 
strangers* again?  I mean, I don't even know them, they don't know 
me, they just lie there in their beds, what is *the point* exactly, 
Gran?  Torture?  What on earth are you talking about, Woman?" 
Neville asks again and again.  Ugh.

No, the Bang will have to come in the scene where Reverse Memory 
Charm Neville *comes to grips* with what he has been forced to live 
with for 14 nightmare-ridden years.  He can even have a flashback 
when he does this, if you want.  I will look to Neville's ability to 
finally work the ToadKeeper spell to restore his parents for my 
final Oscar-winning Big scene, then I will roll the credits.

Elkins again:
 
> Or, if you *really* wanted Big and Bangy, you could even grit your 
> teeth and adopt Tex's suggestion of Tortured Neville.  

I think Tex (was it Tex or Eric Oppen?) will have to row that boat 
upstream himself.  It has Edge (I think), but I don't see why the 
Lestranges would torture Neville.  Canon says that the Lestranges 
tortured Frank to get Frank to talk.  I don't see how Frank goes 
insane if someone tortures Neville.  I mean, why bother?  I need 
someone to set the scene for me there.

Elkins again:

> And besides, who ever heard of a "Reverse Memory Charm," anyway?  
> There's no such thing in canon.  What we do have are Memory 
Charms. <snip>  you want to make it a Reverse 
> Memory Charm just 'cause you're a little bit *squeamish?*  

OK, now, that really hurt.  Aside from the fact that you've come 
right out and said I'm squeamish and therefore not Tough, you're 
saying the Reverse Memory Charm doesn't exist in canon.  Ouch!  And 
you said you were agnostic on the subject of Memory Charms and were 
willing to work with me if I'd go along on Avery.  I feel soiled 
somehow.  

Reverse Memory Charms are not *directly* mentioned in canon, true.  
You know, kind of the way Avery's backstory isn't directly mentioned 
in canon.  <g> But the Reverse Memory Charm *clues* are there.  

There's also the fact that Memory Charm Neville is so darn 
*obvious*.  I'd say 98% of the people who read the first four books 
work out Memory Charm Neville completely on their own.  Is JKR so 
comfortable with her fancy new husband and her fancy new mansion and 
her fancy new wallet that she's not even going to *try* to shock us 
with Neville's backstory?  I just can't accept that.  I can't and I 
won't! ::holds breath, turns red in the face::

Besides, how is JKR going to answer important backstory questions 
with Memory Charm Neville?  How on earth were the Lestranges and 
Crouch Jr. caught (quickly, IMHO) without Neville's evidence?  If 
Neville has a Memory Charm and so has no memory of the torture of 
his parents, why has he been so tight-lipped about it?  Does he just 
go visit his parents, hear the whole story from Gran again, and then 
just forget it the minute he gets back to Hogwarts?

I originally wrote:

> > So I issue a challenge. Something Big must be going on with 
> > Neville. Surely he isn't going to spend seven books as a timid, 
> > forgetful boy chasing after a useless toad. What is Neville's 
> > backstory, then? Any takers?

I'd like to think my Neville Reverse Memory Charm Rope-A-Dope has 
fended off Elkins' rather vigorous assault. But I must point out 
that I *still* haven't heard an alternative backstory explanation of 
what is going on with Neville and Trevor.  

The challenge still stands.  ::looks around the room hopefully::

Cindy